What do you define as a jogress or a fusion?

Hydranoid413

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Personally I’d define a jogress as “two Digimon of the same level combining to evolve to one component’s regular next stage, with one component being ‘primary’ and one ‘secondary’”, while a fusion would be “two or more Digimon combining to form something neither can evolve into alone, with each component being equal, and not necessarily being the same level”.

Examples of the former: Paildramon in 02 (ExVeemon primary, Stingmon secondary) and Holydramon in the D-3 (Angewomon primary, Lillymon secondary)

Examples of the latter: Omegamon in Our War Game (WarGreymon and MetalGarurumon) and Millenniumon in Anode/Cathode Tamer (Machinedramon + Chimeramon)

If considering it as a combination of all the Spirits and not KaiserGreymon and MagnaGarurumon I’m not sure what Susanoomon would fall under since the Fire and Light Spirits are clearly above the others, but it’s not a jogress. (The same also applies to KaiserGreymon and MagnaGarurumon themselves)
 

Muur

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The same Bandai told us

Jogress - two Digimon combining to become the next level

Fusion - two combining to be the same level

I don't see much point going against the official descriptions
 

Digiforlife

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Although Omegamon's case is bit more complicated though. In most cases Omegamon is Mega level and therefore it is the result of fusion of Wargreymon and Metalgarurumon. Yet in recent games e.g. Cyber Sleuth, Digimon Rearise etc where Omegamon & all its variants is Ultra (Super ultimate) level and thus it is the result of jogress of Wargreymon and Metalgarurumon.
 

Chimera-gui

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Yeah seconding Muur on this.

While Jogresses and Fusions can have a primary/secondary component dynamic, particularly those that were originally DigiXrosses due to that mechanic revolving around secondary components empowering the primary component in one way or another, that is more the underlying narrative and has no actual bearing on whether or not a combination is considered a Jogress or a Fusion.

To put it in the simplest of terms, all Jogresses are technically Fusions but not all Fusions are necessarily Jogresses since a Fusion needs to result in a Digimon whose Level is higher than the Levels of its components to be regarded as a Jogress as Digiforlife explained above regarding Omegamon.
 
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Tarama

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all Jogresses are technically Fusions but not all Fusions are necessarily Jogresses
Yeah. Second this.

That's why Omegamon can be called a Jogress (V-Tamer) or a Fusion (Adventure, Xros Wars).
 

Darklabo

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all Jogresses are technically Fusions but not all Fusions are necessarily Jogresses
Yeah. Second this.

That's why Omegamon can be called a Jogress (V-Tamer) or a Fusion (Adventure, Xros Wars).
It can also be noted that V-Tamers considers Omegamon to be a Jogress and a regular Mega at the same time, although their definitions contradicts each other.

Bruh.
 

Chimera-gui

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all Jogresses are technically Fusions but not all Fusions are necessarily Jogresses
Yeah. Second this.

That's why Omegamon can be called a Jogress (V-Tamer) or a Fusion (Adventure, Xros Wars).
It can also be noted that V-Tamers considers Omegamon to be a Jogress and a regular Mega at the same time, although their definitions contradicts each other.

Bruh.
Omegamon is noteworthy for having been classified as a Jogress, a Fusion and a DigiXross depending on the medium.
 
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Tarama

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It can also be noted that V-Tamers considers Omegamon to be a Jogress and a regular Mega at the same time, although their definitions contradicts each other.
Super Ultimate digimon exist, but they always can be considered as Ultimate. Always. That's why we called it (Super) Ultimate/Cho Kyukyokutai.
 

McGann

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all Jogresses are technically Fusions but not all Fusions are necessarily Jogresses
Yeah. Second this.

That's why Omegamon can be called a Jogress (V-Tamer) or a Fusion (Adventure, Xros Wars).
It can also be noted that V-Tamers considers Omegamon to be a Jogress and a regular Mega at the same time, although their definitions contradicts each other.

Bruh.
Omegamon is noteworthy for having been classified as a Jogress, a Fusion and a DigiXross depending on the medium.
Even a flippin' AppGattai in the Card/Video Game.
EDIT: Incidentally, given all the inconsistencies, I don't think it's even worth head-cannoning. They're all just basically fusions.

ShootingStarmon was considered to be notably a Jogress instead of a DigiXros.
The characters are amazed by this, despite their being functionally identical, which was weird.
I guess you could consider Xros to be more of a toy gimmick; partsformers that you can combine and interchange, a bit like Bionicles.
 
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Darklabo

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It can also be noted that V-Tamers considers Omegamon to be a Jogress and a regular Mega at the same time, although their definitions contradicts each other.
Super Ultimate digimon exist, but they always can be considered as Ultimate. Always. That's why we called it (Super) Ultimate/Cho Kyukyokutai.
This logic works when two different media are taken into account.
When, in the same medium, a Digimon is considered both an Ultimate and a Super-Ultimate, it's an inconsistency.

In particular in V-Tamers, the medium which established the concept of Super-Ultimate, all this to contradict the definition within the manga itself.
It's not serious.
 

Chimera-gui

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I guess you could consider Xros to be more of a toy gimmick; partsformers that you can combine and interchange, a bit like Bionicles.
You joke but that's more or less what differentiates DigiXross from other fusion-based Digivolutionary processes when we ignore the previously mentioned narrative dynamic of primary/secondary components:
Wikimon said:
Unlike a Jogress, the DigiXros that results from a combination of Digimon depends only on the lowest base Digimon ("DigiXros Units") involved, and not the immediate components that fused together.
The example given is Shoutmon X4 who can be formed from any combination of the component Digimon Shoutmon (including King Shoutmon), Ballistamon, Dorulumon, the Starmons, or any pre-existing DigiXrosses involving these Digimon such as Shoutmon + Star Sword (Shoutmon x Starmons), Shoutmon + Dorulu Cannon (Shoutmon x Dorulumon), Shoutmon X2 (Shoutmon x Ballistamon), Shoutmon X3 (Shoutmon x Ballistamon x Dorulumon), Dorulumon + Starmons (self-explanatory) and Ballistamon Sextet Launcher (Ballistamon x Dorulumon).
 
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sirtao

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terminology has changed over time. Jogress used to be synonym(hell, furigana) of "Merging", but the introduction of different terminologies for various kind of merging changed things.

As of currently:
  • Merge\Fusion: there is no progression in level. The resulting digimon has a single merged consciousness.
  • Jogress: there is a progression in level. The resulting digimon has a single merged consciousness.(partially averted with 02 digimons, though i think Syplhymon was the only example?)
  • Matrix Evolution: human and Digimon merge, usually result into a progression in level(we haven't seen Matrix with Ultimates, so it's hard to say for certain). Human and 'mon keep their consciousnesses.
  • Double\Hyper\Ancient Spirit Evolution: evolving to a specific form depending on the Spirits used. Humans involved keep their consciousnesses, it's unclear what would happen to digimons.
  • DigiXross: multiple digimon merge into one, which might or might not progress in level. The digimon involved keep their consciousness. though one might be the primary commander of the body.
    • Forced DigiXross: same as DigiXross, but the consciousness of all parts except the one initiating it is suppressed
 

Chimera-gui

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@sirtao That's basically it though we've only really concerned ourselves with Fusion, Jogress and DigiXross for the sake of simplicity.

Interestingly RagnaLordmon is described not only retaining the consciousnesses of Durandamon and Bryweludramon, which its profile even notes as unusual since that is historically a DigiXross characteristic as was noted above, but the profile states that the main body additionally has its own separate consciousness with the level of coordination between these three consciousnesses being described as stunning.

I honestly think because the Legend-Arms as a group were introduced in Xros Wars with Spadamon, Bandai wanted a combination Digimon that had both the single merged consciousness aspect of Jogress/Fusion and retention of components' consciousnesses aspect of DigiXross resulting in something akin to the Fusion Gems of Steven Universe.
 

sirtao

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@sirtao That's basically it though we've only really concerned ourselves with Fusion, Jogress and DigiXross for the sake of simplicity.

Interestingly RagnaLordmon is described not only retaining the consciousnesses of Durandamon and Bryweludramon, which its profile even notes as unusual since that is historically a DigiXross characteristic as was noted above, but the profile states that the main body additionally has its own separate consciousness with the level of coordination between these three consciousnesses being described as stunning.

I honestly think because the Legend-Arms as a group were introduced in Xros Wars with Spadamon, Bandai wanted a combination Digimon that had both the single merged consciousness aspect of Jogress/Fusion and retention of components' consciousnesses aspect of DigiXross resulting in something akin to the Fusion Gems of Steven Universe.
I think it's because they are, in fact, Legend-Arms, that usually become weapons for other digimon.
So their jogres results in a new consciousness, like all\most jogress, but also keeping their original consciousness
 

Ragnalord

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@sirtao

Interestingly RagnaLordmon is described not only retaining the consciousnesses of Durandamon and Bryweludramon, which its profile even notes as unusual since that is historically a DigiXross characteristic as was noted above, but the profile states that the main body additionally has its own separate consciousness with the level of coordination between these three consciousnesses being described as stunning.

That is why it's type is unique, chaosmon is unique also due to still retaining the digicore of both digimon that fused into it, in a normal fusion/jogress, both digicore fuse.

DigiXross I guess is kind of unique in that all digimon fused with still retain their consciousnesses.
 

miru

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Heck, back in the Pendulums, a Jogress didn’t necessarily even involve fusion, though this may have been more a game mechanic than anything else, as Jogress between two units would result in two digimon, often two distinct species if two versions were used. Many of these early designs did indeed look like fusions of the two “intended” component species, albeit more subtly than the 02 ones. In addition, you could Jogress an Adult with a Perfect to get another Perfect. Anyway, here’s how I define it:

* True Fusion - No level progression, and an equal merger of consciousness between the two members. Rarer the other types.
* Jogress - Progresses up a level for at least one member, but the merger is not equal, one member dominates while the other is secondary. This applies to both physical and consciousness elements of the Digimon, though a fusion does not necessarily occur between them, though the less-dominant Digimon is weakened by this, so they often do so for safety. A Jogress with an obviously weaker Digimon results in little to no benefit for the stronger one, only the weaker one. This is a common way to nourish weaker species, but feminine Digimon prefer other methods.
* Matrix Evolution - A Digimon uses a human as a stimulant and data source, and the human uses the Digimon as protection, keeping the consciousness separate. Goes up several levels to Ultimate.
* DigiXros - Digimon fuse with a clearly tiered order, with one central Digimon and several others gradually radiating out in prominence. Consciousnesses are kept separate, but the more Digimon are added, the more they risk going unconscious for the duration of the Xros. Of course, lower-level Digimon and those further in prominence/position from the core are at greater risk of fainting. Leveling up… is tricky. Two same-level Digimon would go up a level depending on how close they are to each other (see Shoutmon X2 vs ShouCutemon), with pre-Xrossed species having less power over this than natural ones as seen with Shoutmon X3 and X4. If the main Digimon is of a lower level than the component, the levels are averaged out; where the sum of each level is added, then divided by the number of components to get an average number, which is rounded down for the core being Adult level or below, or up for if the core is of Perfect level or higher. So JijiShoutmon is an Adult level, for example. Lower-level Digimon have no effect on the level for an Xros dominated by a higher-level Digimon. Forced Xros is similar, but all Digimon bar the core lose consciousness. For the record, this is what Etemon did when he merged with the Dark Network. When an Xros is slain, shockwaves are sent from the core Digimon that damage other Digimon in the process unless the merger is pulled out of in time, unconscious Digimon obviously have less of a chance to escape the death waves.
* HumanXros: What Kurata did to Belphemon in Savers; using himself as the core, he managed to dominate Belphemon’s consciousness.
 

Theigno

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DigiXross I guess is kind of unique in that all digimon fused with still retain their consciousnesses.
I don't think that's actually the case. For example the DRB entry for Shoutmon DX clearly portrays it as having a new consciousness that merely borrows from the "instincts" of its components (And others seem to use this approach implicitly). The anime might have portrayed it differently but that's just one continuity, and even here I am not sure if it actually applied consistently; For example I don't remember anything indicating separate consciousness existing within DarkKnightmon.

And given how for example the Super Xros Wars Story games lump anything from normal fusions or jogresses under the same umbrella term of Xros, the safest assumption would simply be that Xros can result in basically anything.
 

Ragnalord

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In the xros war manga it was also said that each body parts had separate consciousness.
 

Chimera-gui

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@miru I don't think you needed to over-complicate DigiXross when most of the ones likely to be seen outside the anime already have official Levels and any that don't are likely going to when they are added to the Field Guide.

DigiXross I guess is kind of unique in that all digimon fused with still retain their consciousnesses.
I don't think that's actually the case. For example the DRB entry for Shoutmon DX clearly portrays it as having a new consciousness that merely borrows from the "instincts" of its components (And others seem to use this approach implicitly). The anime might have portrayed it differently but that's just one continuity, and even here I am not sure if it actually applied consistently; For example I don't remember anything indicating separate consciousness existing within DarkKnightmon.

And given how for example the Super Xros Wars Story games lump anything from normal fusions or jogresses under the same umbrella term of Xros, the safest assumption would simply be that Xros can result in basically anything.
To be fair, DigiXross is what happens when you expand/explore Fusion/Jogress as the core mechanic so it's not too surprising that characteristics of the latter carryover into the former especially when it comes to the Field Guide and games.

That said, I do think Bagramon and DarkKnightmon were separate consciousnesses within DarkestKnightmon/DarknessBagramon (hence how the former can usurp the latter while they were fused) and as Ragnalord rightly noted the manga does present certain body parts in a DigiXross as fully sapient and even able to speak:
MetalGreymon_Speaks.jpg

Granted, XW MetalGreymon is basically a cyborg Amphisbaena so it makes sense that both ends are able to talk.
 
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