Unpopular opinions and rants about the Digimon franchize.

[JR9386]

Koshiro wouldn’t have seen Seraphimon during the Cherubimon fight anyway. I’m not home right now, so I can’t check exactly what he said (in the original; we know the third movie is canon to the dub).

Looking forward to it.

Watching 'Loss' now (Dub), and now I have a follow-up question from the same scene. In the dub, Tentomon asks Izzy if he has a Mega form. Izzy answers in the affirmative as if to imply that he's achieved that form before. Is there any source material outside of the main anime that features that, or am I totally off base and it's a bad dubbing error?

 

[TMS]

You’re apparently forgetting HerakleKabuterimon debuted in Part 3.

 

[JR9386]

You’re apparently forgetting HerakleKabuterimon debuted in Part 3.

I really need to binge watch the films...

 

[Yamato-san]

I was just thinking back to it, and I honestly hate how a lot of video games released during the Savers era just had the main protagonist Digimon from that series as starting choices (especially games that had little to actually do with Savers, like Digimon Masters and the first Digimon Story). Aside from being fairly uninspired (most other video games at least try to give you non-anime Digimon), the main Savers cast fails pretty horribly at Vaccine-Data-Virus balance (much like Adventure, Savers seems to have a pretty severe anti-Virus slant, though I guess that wouldn't have been the case had the PawnChessmon just gotten more focus).

 

[e105zeta]

I was just thinking back to it, and I honestly hate how a lot of video games released during the Savers era just had the main protagonist Digimon from that series as starting choices (especially games that had little to actually do with Savers, like Digimon Masters and the first Digimon Story). Aside from being fairly uninspired (most other video games at least try to give you non-anime Digimon), the main Savers cast fails pretty horribly at Vaccine-Data-Virus balance (much like Adventure, Savers seems to have a pretty severe anti-Virus slant, though I guess that wouldn't have been the case had the PawnChessmon just gotten more focus).

I find it super weird that Ikuto's Falcomon wasn't a Virus both to distinguish itself from the old Falcomon and because it's very combat/espionage/darkness themed.

Also, on that note: I feel like Falcomon Accel and Falcomon Savers are so dang different they shouldn't have been a subspecies to begin with.

Especially since Falcomon is clearly a falcon while Falcomon 2006 looks like an owl/crow hybrid.

I realize that Owlmon was already taken and Fukumon would be too easily corrupted for an international audience, but there were options. Crowmon, Kuromon, Karasumon, Corvimon, Glaucumon, Strixmon, Wegyetmon . . .

At least Kudamon 1 and Kudamon 2 still look mostly like the same species from the waist up.

 

[Muur]

I was just thinking back to it, and I honestly hate how a lot of video games released during the Savers era just had the main protagonist Digimon from that series as starting choices (especially games that had little to actually do with Savers, like Digimon Masters and the first Digimon Story). Aside from being fairly uninspired (most other video games at least try to give you non-anime Digimon), the main Savers cast fails pretty horribly at Vaccine-Data-Virus balance (much like Adventure, Savers seems to have a pretty severe anti-Virus slant, though I guess that wouldn't have been the case had the PawnChessmon just gotten more focus).

Digimon Masters is set in the Data Squad universe and you play as DATs with everyone from the anime being in the game, even random characters of the week like that pro boxer and his trainer.

 

[Yamato-san]

I was just thinking back to it, and I honestly hate how a lot of video games released during the Savers era just had the main protagonist Digimon from that series as starting choices (especially games that had little to actually do with Savers, like Digimon Masters and the first Digimon Story). Aside from being fairly uninspired (most other video games at least try to give you non-anime Digimon), the main Savers cast fails pretty horribly at Vaccine-Data-Virus balance (much like Adventure, Savers seems to have a pretty severe anti-Virus slant, though I guess that wouldn't have been the case had the PawnChessmon just gotten more focus).

Digimon Masters is set in the Data Squad universe and you play as DATs with everyone from the anime being in the game, even random characters of the week like that pro boxer and his trainer.

They still could've went with better starting options. To my understanding, you're just a random newcomer at DATS (though you can have an avatar based on one of the Savers mains, they do not represent them in story and you're capable of customizing the avatar afterwards).

 

[Bancho]

I want the Legend Arms to be explored a lot more. Spadamon in particular has got me thinking this because I was wondering why they're in the new Adventure: anime as one of Leomon's right hand Digimon without being utilized by Leomon himself or any of the other characters as the weapon that it is. I'm cool with Spadamon not having evolutions but only if I get to see its potential as a weapon wielded by others a whole lot more than we do when it shows up. Luckily Xros Wars did utilize its weapon form, granted it was treated as a Digixros rather than somebody naturally wielding Spadamon but that's entirely semantics as it's probably the same end result.
But this just had me thinking about how little material we have on Legend Arms in general. Where did they come from? How many more are there? Is there an actual connection between Legend Arms or did they all pop up from different backgrounds and circumstances? Are they related to the numerous Digimon who transform into weapons to attack or become a legendary weapon through jogress (Ouryumon, Omnimon)? Can we get more of them, there's only 2 lines and 2 standalones?

 

[Kit Chan]

I prefered when the vpets had longer life cycles and were about raising and maintaining a pet. Now they have much faster life cycles and it seems to be about trying all the evolution paths to fill a catalog.

 

[Tortoiseshel]

I prefered when the vpets had longer life cycles and were about raising and maintaining a pet. Now they have much faster life cycles and it seems to be about trying all the evolution paths to fill a catalog.

Huge agree here; as much fun as I'm having with my new Vital Bracelet, it's taken a noticeably shorter time to reach Adult compared to older v-pets like my Pendulum Progress. Which also means I've engaged in more physical activity in a few days than I usually do in like, a month so all my muscles are on fire right now.

But what I'm especially annoyed about is that, no doubt due to the popularity and ubiquity of Pokemon, every monster raising franchise now seems like it has to center monster collecting of some sort, even when that doesn't gel with the other mechanics/premise of the game. For Digimon Story games, I guess it's okay since it's about building RPG parties. But for v-pets/Digimon World-style games, trying to cram in a catalog like you said takes away from what I think should be the main experience, and what I think is most special and unique about Digimon compared to other monster series: raising and caring for your Digimon as a companion, not just a party member or summon.

And yes I know the original Digimon World had a catalog you could fill out by obtaining all available Digimon+collectable character cards, but there's a difference between rewarding a player for completion and like, what the Pendulum Z does where it pops a special screen up every time you get a new evolution. Achievement Trophies vs. Pokedex as a Major Mechanic.

 

[qwopwaffle]

I would like for the anime to grow up. To be marketed at an older audience, and dive deeper into lore of digimon. Not having digimon as nothing more than good vs. evil battle pets. We never get to really see and digimon interaction between one another like in World.

Also, in my opinion, if the writers and producers could incorporate ideas from s4 so that the digi-destined can be more than moral support for their digimon who are throwing fkng nuclear warheads at each other. Like if the tamers could somehow aquire the ability to armor digivolve in order to fight along side their partners, (with a risk/reward system for plot) i think the show would stand out more.

 

[Muur]

Tri and Kizuna was aimed at adults

 

[Bancho]

But what I'm especially annoyed about is that, no doubt due to the popularity and ubiquity of Pokemon, every monster raising franchise now seems like it has to center monster collecting of some sort, even when that doesn't gel with the other mechanics/premise of the game

I feel like it's okay how the Digimon games are doing it as with modern World and v-pets it's still raising two partners and bonding with them and not collecting them all in a PC prison like they're objects like Pokemon does and like you said, Story is pretty much like sports dream teams simulators but with Digimon. However, this is entirely why I can't get into the Digimon mobile games: they treat Digimon as gacha objects and trophies with no room for care and bonding where you just spend up your invaluable digimon pulls. It's so antithesis to a series centered on virtual pet raising and fantasy world adventuring, not gacha garbage

I would like for the anime to grow up. To be marketed at an older audience, and dive deeper into lore of digimon

my issue with the anime is that it keeps feeling like it promises story with the holy digimon and great war against Millenniumon but all it seems to care about is monster fights. Who is Millenniumon, what was his goals and personality and how did he initially form in the events before the story? Haha I still don't know he's literally just a monster who hasn't talked once and none of my feelings of unfulfillment has anything to do with it being a kids' show

 

[Yamato-san]

I would like for the anime to grow up. To be marketed at an older audience, and dive deeper into lore of digimon. Not having digimon as nothing more than good vs. evil battle pets. We never get to really see and digimon interaction between one another like in World.

Also, in my opinion, if the writers and producers could incorporate ideas from s4 so that the digi-destined can be more than moral support for their digimon who are throwing fkng nuclear warheads at each other. Like if the tamers could somehow aquire the ability to armor digivolve in order to fight along side their partners, (with a risk/reward system for plot) i think the show would stand out more.

Someone not too long ago brought it up, but they pointed out how Adventure: getting released shortly after Kizuna, where the loss of Partners could be viewed as a metaphor for growing up, comes off like Bamco telling the adult audience to fuck off and that Digimon is for kids again. Now, given that the franchise is still dishing out some expensiveAF figures and other memorabilia, that's probably not the case, but it would suck if they really are casting aside any more adult-centric media.

Also, I feel the need to bring up this post again.

Unpopular opinions and rants about the Digimon franchize.

I mean, so what? Other kids anime deal with violent death. There’s no reason Digimon couldn’t if it wanted to. As for the idea of Partner Digimon killing a human, I have zero doubts that it could happen. Hell, we see all the time that certain wild/independent Digimon would have no qualms...

withthewill.net

Really, while I don't feel that the Cyber Sleuth games are as mature as some make them out to be, in a lot of other ways, they were an overall solid attempt at shifting the franchise's demographic from children to young adults. The same could probably be said about Tamers as well (in spite of the merchandising making it seem very much aimed at the kiddies).

Incidentally, how is Digimon Tamers 1983? I never did bother tracking down wherever you'd be able to read it, but I somehow kept getting the impression that it's one of the best instances of "Digimon for adults" out there.

 

[Tortoiseshel]

But what I'm especially annoyed about is that, no doubt due to the popularity and ubiquity of Pokemon, every monster raising franchise now seems like it has to center monster collecting of some sort, even when that doesn't gel with the other mechanics/premise of the game

I feel like it's okay how the Digimon games are doing it as with modern World and v-pets it's still raising two partners and bonding with them and not collecting them all in a PC prison like they're objects like Pokemon does and like you said, Story is pretty much like sports dream teams simulators but with Digimon. However, this is entirely why I can't get into the Digimon mobile games: they treat Digimon as gacha objects and trophies with no room for care and bonding where you just spend up your invaluable digimon pulls. It's so antithesis to a series centered on virtual pet raising and fantasy world adventuring, not gacha garbage

I mostly agree with you, but the Story games are still the ones that get all the hype and attention and praise even from non-fandom outlets, and get localized more often than World games and v-pets, so I'm still pretty hmmm >:/

Totally with you on the mobile games, though. Which really sucks because smartphones would be the perfect platform for new v-pets. Although at least fans have been doing cool stuff in that department, so it's not so bad.

 

[Yamato-san]

Frankly, I like me my critter-collecting RPGs, but I can still acknowledge and respect Digimon's origins as a V-pet. Still, I can't say that spending days at a time raising a fighter that's going to die in a short time is something that especially interests me personally, but I did enjoy the first Digimon World, and I could stand to get around to Re: Digitize Decode (which I have downloaded on my 3DS right now) and/or next 0rder at some point (I also dabbled a tiny bit in the Monster Rancher games, for what it's worth). I guess it is worth praising the console games significantly speed up the raising process, reducing a single lifecycle from literal days to just a couple hours, not to mention having a full-on adventure packed with CPU opponents for your Digimon to actually be able to battle with, rather than hoping and praying that there's a fellow V-pet enthusiast in your area for your Digimon to be capable of the one key feature that sets it apart from Tamagotchi (though I guess recent V-pets have included CPU opponents? I never really kept up on the info).

As an aside, though, I will say that converting a V-pet into an RPG sure does make most lower-level Digimon awkwardly useless in terms of function. I mean, yeah, I like having that Botamon be part of my collection (also, props to Cyber Sleuth for separating the BabyI and BabyII stages, unlike the DS games), but it's really not gonna be accomplishing much, even at level 99. And Fladramon is infamous for being obtained too late to be useful*. But I guess it's similar to unevolved Pokemon (except if it applied to like 80% of the roster...... no wonder they cram these games full of Ultimates). Still, the Cyber Sleuth games' party memory system is one way of keeping them relevant for a good portion of the playthrough (especially if you're the type who'd prefer quantity over quality for your party), but I especially think that the online event battles introduced in Hacker's Memory (which follow some sort of special rules, commonly evolution-stage restriction..... AND memory restriction, so you'd have to re-consider just steamrolling everything with that 14 memory Lucemon) are a step in the right direction. A shame the offline tournaments couldn't have utilized anything similar, though.

*Honestly, though, I feel Fladramon is greatly under-rated as a utility Digimon. I don't know if it was intentional, but Armor Digimon (including Fladra) contribute to Hacker Skills the same way Ultimates do, AND it only takes up as much party memory as an Adult, so you can activate Hard Security levels 2 or 3 pretty early (being a Free is also nice for Function Call-grinding).

 

[PCN24454]

While people talk about Matt being Tai's best friend a lot, it feels like Izzy more naturally fits into that role.

 

[JR9386]

While people talk about Matt being Tai's best friend a lot, it feels like Izzy more naturally fits into that role.

I would have defaulted on that as well, but I think each of them balances out a different part of Tai's personality.

Honestly, I don't know how I see Tai and Matt's relationship. They're "friends", but I never quite saw it as an organic relationship in say the way Izzy and Tai's is.

 

[e105zeta]

While people talk about Matt being Tai's best friend a lot, it feels like Izzy more naturally fits into that role.

I would have defaulted on that as well, but I think each of them balances out a different part of Tai's personality.

Honestly, I don't know how I see Tai and Matt's relationship. They're "friends", but I never quite saw it as an organic relationship in say the way Izzy and Tai's is.

They’re close work colleagues, essentially.

 

[JR9386]

While people talk about Matt being Tai's best friend a lot, it feels like Izzy more naturally fits into that role.

I would have defaulted on that as well, but I think each of them balances out a different part of Tai's personality.

Honestly, I don't know how I see Tai and Matt's relationship. They're "friends", but I never quite saw it as an organic relationship in say the way Izzy and Tai's is.

They’re close work colleagues, essentially.

Right.

And yet, the films almost play up their friendship as a friendship for the ages. Their Digimon partners Jogress/Fuse, but then, with the way 02 handled those partnerships, maybe you don't need to be super close? Same way Tri handled Meicoomon and Gatomon.

Outside of them being on the same team, I'm not sure that I would have seen ever seen them being friends.

Maybe that's an unpopular opinion, but...

Perhaps they shouldn't have remained friends outside of their roles as Chosen Children.

The only ones I could theoretically see remaining friends are Joe and Mimi, Joe and Izzy, Tai and Izzy, and well that pretty much sums it up for me.

Sora, at least as she's written, I think would have drifted off into her own world doing her own thing. I'm not sure that she would have gotten Biyomon back. Perhaps Biyomon would live on in her art as a source of inspiration. Maybe she should have been a museum curator?

Matt, should have drifted off in his music.

But yeah, I don't really see it realistic that they'd all remain friends.