Random Commentary on Evolutionary Relationships V.4

TMS

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Huh. I like the idea of Dinohumon to the purple Grademon. Dinohumon is such a weird design that it's hard to fit into aesthetically pleasing evolution lines.

The Bandai Asia reference book included it and the JP name was what you listed so it's technically its own species.
Do you mean the Bandai Asia site actually gave a name for it in Japanese? If so, I'd be interested to know how it was written.
 

Chimera-gui

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I feel like the issue is trying to treat Digivolution as being 1:1 with Evolution in Pokemon and specifically the Pokemon games.
There is no issue with treating something like it literally is (strength wise; branching is another topic entirely). Digimon evolve from weaker stages into stronger stages, that's the main point of it.
You could also make the argument that both Digivolution and Pokémon Evolution are meant to be stages in a life cycle rather than the biology definition of Evolution in most cases since contrary to popular belief, Evolution in biology is not a march towards higher complexity, more intelligence or even more adaptability. It’s just a fluctuation of characteristics dictated by environmental pressures and mutation. (e.g. a slime mold isn’t “less evolved” than a hawk, just adapted for success under different parameters.)

Likewise the phrase “Survival of the fittest” simply means that the success of a species hinges on how well it “fits” its environment. It does not mean that stronger or smarter individuals are supposed to succeed. In fact those things can even be a detriment in nature by wasting too many resources.

And no, a few outliers to the general strength of a level like Lucemon, Hackmon and Arkadimon do not change that, especially since in context of to their own lines they do not break the pattern at all; Lucemon and Arkadimon's higher stages are clearly more powerful than their previous ones. It's simply cherry picking single instances that are very clearly meant to be exceptions lore wise anyway, it's not going to overturn common sense any time soon.
Fair enough.

while this naming convention isn't applied to Perfect or Ultimate, they are still technically meant to be life stages and it can be argued that they are life stages that Digimon aspire to reach. To put it simply: Digimon want to live as long as physically possible.
They can also be argued to be levels strength that Digimon want to reach.
That doesn't have to be mutually exclusive from the idea of Digimon wanting to live as long as physically possible though.

The idea of Levels as Life Stages can also be used to explain some of the shenanigans regarding levels such as there being two levels of Whamon: The Perfect level Whamon living off Folder Continent's coast achieved a higher stage of growth/development as a species than their Adult level cousins living in File Island's waters.
The idea doesn't explain anything better than the regular conception of levels. The Perfect Whamon are perfect level whamon because they evolved from Adult Level Digimon and the Adult level Whamon is adult level because it evolved from child level Digimon. Plus the perfect one is stronger.
Whamon is arguably one of the closest examples of Digivolution resembling how Evolution works in actual biology since it was the environmental conditions of Folder Continent's coast vs File Island's that resulted in there being two levels of Whamon in the first place, the fact that Perfect level Whamon are stronger than Adult is simply a side effect of this.

My reason for toddler as a term is because while you do get hopping heads, the majority of them have functional limbs.
It would be a bizarre and unfitting term, since "toddler" very specifically refers to human children, when most Digimon at this stage are not humanoid at all.
Fair enough though I'm not sure if there is a better term to use for the second level.
 

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Huh. I like the idea of Dinohumon to the purple Grademon. Dinohumon is such a weird design that it's hard to fit into aesthetically pleasing evolution lines.

The Bandai Asia reference book included it and the JP name was what you listed so it's technically its own species.
Do you mean the Bandai Asia site actually gave a name for it in Japanese? If so, I'd be interested to know how it was written.
グレイドモン(悪)

we actually talked about this on discord before but the bandai asia DRB didnt have his profile specifically on the wayback machine as it only had the first page cached, rather than the later pages with other species on it, so I couldn't "prove" it.

its possible bandai asia just made the name up since they needed something for the japanese name box.
 

Sparrow Hawk

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Hawkmon > DinoHumon > ? > Leviamon

I'm trying to make this evo line goes back in devolution but way stronger. The modern bird who said to be the descendant of all dinosaurs that ruled the earth before but their ancestors used to rule over the whole ocean!

To reference Gabumon's evo line: Hawkmon > DinoHumon > Garudamon > Spinomon (Modern bird > Dinosaur repeatedly to evolve)

Hawkmon > Diatrymon > MegaloGrowmon > DinoRexmon (Modern bird, Prehistoric flightless Dodo, Raptor then full grown adult raptor)

I wish there is a winged raptor Digimon... But oh whatever. Diatrymon could work for that. Somewhat
 

Sparrow Hawk

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Since he have "Dra" in his name so it's more of Raptor Dragon. And the metal wings located on its back rather than the arms like those winged raptors so no. Nah. But Ornismon does look like one. Also I learnt about Valdurmon's odd body which led me to this "MircoRaptor" species...
 

Kotekuma

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I feel like the issue is trying to treat Digivolution as being 1:1 with Evolution in Pokemon and specifically the Pokemon games. In the Pokemon games, a higher stage Pokemon is almost always stronger than a lower stage one if for no reason than stats (e.g. Charizard can wipe the floor with Squirtle despite an elemental disadvantage since Squirtle statistically lower than Charizard). Obviously this does not apply to the anime since battling in the anime hinges on trainer skill as much if not more so than raw Pokemon stats as explained by Suede in his review of episode nine of season one, The School Of Hard Knocks.

Hell, I'd actually go one step farther by renaming "Fresh/Baby I" to "Infant" and "In-Training/Baby II" to "Toddler" to reflect what the stages are meant to be.
You're pretty off in your comparison to pokemon. The strengths of Digimon relative to their evolution stages are more much likely to fit an expected structure than Pokemon. In most statistical instances at least 90% of Champion digimon are stronger than at least 90% of Rookie Digimon. But with pokemon, the stages do not mean anything other than evolution. Ex: Butterfree (a stage 2 pokemon starting at level 10) has the same stat total as Poliwhirl (a stage 1 pkmn starting at level 25.) I expect you'll find much fewer examples of this in a Digimon game.

If you plot total stat values you'll find that Pokemon have wider deviations within evolutionary stages (of 3-stage lines). Digimon plots (from any Digimon World/Story game) will have more linear clusters.

It would be a bizarre and unfitting term, since "toddler" very specifically refers to human children, when most Digimon at this stage are not humanoid at all.
Couldn't the same be said for "child"? Or is the Agumon, Biyomon lot and crew humanoid enough to warrant the term fitting for Betamon, Kunemon lot?
Or perhaps the Japanese term child doesn't have the same human-specific definition?
 

TMS

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The literal translation of the Japanese word for Child-level is "growth period."
 

Chimera-gui

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I feel like the issue is trying to treat Digivolution as being 1:1 with Evolution in Pokemon and specifically the Pokemon games. In the Pokemon games, a higher stage Pokemon is almost always stronger than a lower stage one if for no reason than stats (e.g. Charizard can wipe the floor with Squirtle despite an elemental disadvantage since Squirtle statistically lower than Charizard). Obviously this does not apply to the anime since battling in the anime hinges on trainer skill as much if not more so than raw Pokemon stats as explained by Suede in his review of episode nine of season one, The School Of Hard Knocks.

Hell, I'd actually go one step farther by renaming "Fresh/Baby I" to "Infant" and "In-Training/Baby II" to "Toddler" to reflect what the stages are meant to be.
You're pretty off in your comparison to pokemon. The strengths of Digimon relative to their evolution stages are more much likely to fit an expected structure than Pokemon. In most statistical instances at least 90% of Champion digimon are stronger than at least 90% of Rookie Digimon. But with pokemon, the stages do not mean anything other than evolution. Ex: Butterfree (a stage 2 pokemon starting at level 10) has the same stat total as Poliwhirl (a stage 1 pkmn starting at level 25.) I expect you'll find much fewer examples of this in a Digimon game.

If you plot total stat values you'll find that Pokemon have wider deviations within evolutionary stages (of 3-stage lines). Digimon plots (from any Digimon World/Story game) will have more linear clusters.
To be fair, Pokemon also doesn't have a set number of stages across all families (3 is the average but we have plenty of families with more or fewer stages) whereas the tradition level system in Digimon consists of six levels not counting special ones like Armor, Hybrid or Super Ultimate. It's just that the majority of Digimon don't live long enough to reach level VI without human aid.

It would be a bizarre and unfitting term, since "toddler" very specifically refers to human children, when most Digimon at this stage are not humanoid at all.
Couldn't the same be said for "child"? Or is the Agumon, Biyomon lot and crew humanoid enough to warrant the term fitting for Betamon, Kunemon lot?
Or perhaps the Japanese term child doesn't have the same human-specific definition?
That's kinda my reasoning for suggesting toddler as the name of level II cause while it's not a perfect fit, level II Digimon are comparable to human toddlers in terms of development as mentioned previously.
 

shepsquared

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This was my immediate thought when I saw the April Fools Crossover - it isn't perfect because we don't have a robotic Kabuterimon line, but you work with what you have.

 

YongYoKyo

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Bolgmon/MetalKabuterimon is a fairly robotic beetle.
 

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That is perfect. Both the line(more or less) and the joke they made.
 

Sparrow Hawk

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MetalliferKuwagamon and Bolgmon have same color. Perfect for Omedamon.
 

Angel-kun

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The colors are ironic here.

Metabee is a Kabuto Medabot (KBT) and its yellow/gold
Rokusho is a Kuwagata Medabot (KWG) and its normally white/blue

Kabuterimon parts are normally blue, but i think the best is using Heracles Kabuterimon (Gold) for Metabee parts (Despite he is already both species)
Kuwagamon have different colors, but i think we can use Grandis Kuwagamon or Gran Kuwagamon (black).
 

YongYoKyo

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Best case scenario would be to just convert Metabee and Rokusho into Digimon too, just like how Omegamon was converted into a Medabot on the Medabots' Twitter. Though they don't quite seem like Ultimate-level, nor possibly even Perfect-level material. There's also Cross Messiah (KXK), who's a Kabuto/Kuwagata hybrid Medabot. He could probably fit somewhere.

I could see a Medabots line with Metabee and Rokusho as Adults, Cross Messiah as a Jogressed Perfect, and Omedamon as the Ultimate.
 
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