Digimon whose Level you would Change

[Darklabo]

There's also the issue that "Level VII" is canonically not a true Level but a subsection of Level VI.

why do people say this? Isn't a Lv. 7 outright stated in v-tamer, used in a lot of video games, and heavily used in our currently ongoing card game? Shouldn't it just be treated like Xros fusions, card slashes, digisoul, etc. where it's not universal to every universe but exists in some universes thus making the "not canon" argument empty as there isn't one singular overarching "canon" to base that argument off of?

The issue with V-Tamer (which is also the origin of Super Ultimate-level, and thus should be the most authoritative source)

The most authoritative source is the most recent one, not the one which introduced a concept.
So, for the Super-Ultimate Level, the most relevant source is ReArise.

is that it's acknowledged that simply (Jogress-)evolving from an Ultimate is not enough to be a Super Ultimate, as Omegamon is explicitly still just an Ultimate-level. In the setting of V-Tamer, Arkadimon is the one and only Super Ultimate (until Daemon absorbs Arkadimon, and UlforceV-dramon achieves Future Mode).

And like said before, Holydramon, Mugendramon, HerculesKabuterimon and some others were all Perfect at their debut, but now nobody would argue they aren’t Ultimate.
So even if Omegamon was a regular Ultimate in V-Tamer, it has been retconned as a Super-Ultimate Level since at least Cyber-Sleuth.

As I said in my last post, barring gameplay/mechanical exceptions.

As far as I know, you don’t have the authority to decide what is an exception and what is the rule.
Power-Levels retcon are a thing in Digimon, Omegamon fall under this category and it’s not up to you (nor me) to decide if it’s fair or not.

Also, if you're saying the most recent source is the most authoritative, then again, I point to the recent Profile Report that doesn't acknowledge that they're higher in level.

Isn’t the last ReArise update more recent than the last Profile Report ?
Eh, even if it’s not the case, I guess it’s just a matter of time.
Like RagnaLordmon is technically not a Super-Ultimate Level but will eventually become one in the future.

 

[YongYoKyo]

There no distinction. « Narrative » « and « Categorical » are both parts of the DRB, if one is wrong, the entire profile is wrong.
You’re just trying to make a distinction which doesn’t exist in the first place

The distinction clearly exists. The profiles are literally separated into different sections. The thumbnail reference artwork, the categorizations, and the lore profile at the bottom, etc.

Also, as you evidently glossed over, I never said it was wrong. I said that it was right, but for a specific media. I should also say the same to you; you took the Super Ultimate part of Armagemon's profile as "right", but stated that the other part was "wrong". That's not how proof works, as I said before.

And they just updated ReArise and Omegamon and alike were still Super-Ultimate Levels, and I’m pretty sure the next update will not change a thing.
Again, whatever if the DRB recognize the existence of the SU-Level or not, the overall canon doesn’t need it.

Not drastically changing the gameplay-mechanics of a 3-years-old game does not mean it's more recent than a week-old information-report about the overall canon. You just went on a rant about how maintaining "outdated" information does not make it relevant to the present, yet you're applying this same logic to your own argument. This right here shows that a logical argument with you is useless. You simply just refuse to acknowledge anything you don't agree with.

 

[Darklabo]

There no distinction. « Narrative » « and « Categorical » are both parts of the DRB, if one is wrong, the entire profile is wrong.
You’re just trying to make a distinction which doesn’t exist in the first place

The distinction clearly exists. The profiles are literally separated into different sections. The thumbnail reference artwork, the categorizations, and the lore profile at the bottom, etc.

There no distinction. All of those section are still parts of one Digimon profile.
They’re all about one individual and if this wasn’t the case they wouldn’t be relevant to each other so your point shouldn’t stand either.

Also, as you evidently glossed over, I never said it was wrong. I said that it was right, but for a specific media. I should also say the same to you; you took the Super Ultimate part of Armagemon's profile as "right", but stated that the other part was "wrong". That's not how proof works, as I said before.

I literally never stated that Armageddemon’s profile was right.
Armageddemon is an Ultra because it’s considered to be in official medias which are relevant to the overall canon.
For the third time, the DRB doesn’t matter in this case, neither for Armaggedemon nor for any Digimon since the DRB just can’t disprove the existence of the Super-Ultimate Level. You’re the one making distinction where there is none here, just because you refuse to accept being wrong. Don’t try to share the flaws of your argument with me.

And they just updated ReArise and Omegamon and alike were still Super-Ultimate Levels, and I’m pretty sure the next update will not change a thing.
Again, whatever if the DRB recognize the existence of the SU-Level or not, the overall canon doesn’t need it.

Not drastically changing the gameplay-mechanics of a 3-years-old game does not mean it's more recent than a week-old information-report about the overall canon. You just went on a rant about how maintaining "outdated" information does not make it relevant to the present, yet you're applying this same logic to your own argument. This right here shows that a logical argument with you is useless. You simply just refuse to acknowledge anything you don't agree with.

It’s exactly what that mean, ReArise being constantly updated is currently the most recent Digimon media, and so the most relevant. Not like I’m surprised that you’re too biased to accept another evidence on how the overall canon works.
None of my argument is outdated, again, don’t try to apply your inconsistent logic to me just because you don’t know how the Digimon series works.
In the end the fact remains that the Super-Ultimate Level/Lvl VII is a reality, and whether you like it or not will not change anything.
Go complain to Bandai and stop wasting my time.

 

[TMS]

Alright, guys, back on topic. Clearly no one’s going to admit being wrong on this.

 

[Bancho]

Omekamon makes sense being an adult in terms of how it looks since it doesn't look more powerful than an adult, but I always feel like it's hard to use in evolution lines because ToyAgumon/Ekakimon/etc. jumps straight to being a toy Omnimon and it's hard to know where to go from there. I feel like if the concept (not the design) was used for a perfect or mega stage digimon, it would be easier to utilize. You could use ExTyrannomon but ExTyrannomon is also hard to find thematic evolutions

 

[Muur]

Omekamon makes sense being an adult in terms of how it looks since it doesn't look more powerful than an adult, but I always feel like it's hard to use in evolution lines because ToyAgumon/Ekakimon/etc. jumps straight to being a toy Omnimon and it's hard to know where to go from there. I feel like if the concept (not the design) was used for a perfect or mega stage digimon, it would be easier to utilize. You could use ExTyrannomon but ExTyrannomon is also hard to find thematic evolutions

Tinmon works perfectly for Omekamon. Prob more fitting for the random commentary thread though

 

[Mon-Ohma]

Personally I feel like LovelyAngemon should be either an Adult or Perfect.

 

[Chimera-gui]

Personally I feel like LovelyAngemon should be either an Adult or Perfect.

Bare in mind that Lovely was made as an alternative to Ophanimon who wasn't a dragon, Aphrodite or linked to Meicoomon.

 

[Yamato-san]

Personally I feel like LovelyAngemon should be either an Adult or Perfect.

Bare in mind that Lovely was made as an alternative to Ophanimon who wasn't a dragon, Aphrodite or linked to Meicoomon.

Jesus Christ. I forget who it was who pointed out that there's a bottlenecking of Perfects, but I'm further reminded that they weren't kidding.

For the long and short of it, the massive influx of newly-introduced Ultimates over the years led to a lot of them evolving from the same Perfect due to the fact that Perfects haven't been expanded on as well (and there's never been a shortage on the number of Adults in the franchise). I think during the time of the Pendulum Z releases, this was noted by someone who was welcoming the introduction of more new Perfects that don't belong to any specific evolution line (I specifically remember them pointing to Digitamamon as an example, which makes sense when you consider that Minervamon and Titamon, at least pre-Rebellimon, seem to have made it their canon Perfect form just for the hell of it, despite already having Devitamamon and I guess the unreleased HolyDigitamamon).

 

[Chimera-gui]

Personally I feel like LovelyAngemon should be either an Adult or Perfect.

Bare in mind that Lovely was made as an alternative to Ophanimon who wasn't a dragon, Aphrodite or linked to Meicoomon.

Jesus Christ. I forget who it was who pointed out that there's a bottlenecking of Perfects, but I'm further reminded that they weren't kidding.

For the long and short of it, the massive influx of newly-introduced Ultimates over the years led to a lot of them evolving from the same Perfect due to the fact that Perfects haven't been expanded on as well (and there's never been a shortage on the number of Adults in the franchise). I think during the time of the Pendulum Z releases, this was noted by someone who was welcoming the introduction of more new Perfects that don't belong to any specific evolution line (I specifically remember them pointing to Digitamamon as an example, which makes sense when you consider that Minervamon and Titamon, at least pre-Rebellimon, seem to have made it their canon Perfect form just for the hell of it, despite already having Devitamamon and I guess the unreleased HolyDigitamamon).

That's actually why I'm fine with DarkKnightmon, Weddinmon, Splashmon, Zamielmon and Gravimon being Level V instead of Level VI, Bandai clearly wanted to avoid bottlenecking by adding a relatively equal amount of Level V and VI Digimon and they weren't gonna fuck with Bagramon, Blastmon or Tactimon.

Even Baalmon and Mervamon were likely going to be Level V and VI respectively due to the Digimon they're related to.

 

[e105zeta]

Personally I feel like LovelyAngemon should be either an Adult or Perfect.

Bare in mind that Lovely was made as an alternative to Ophanimon who wasn't a dragon, Aphrodite or linked to Meicoomon.

Jesus Christ. I forget who it was who pointed out that there's a bottlenecking of Perfects, but I'm further reminded that they weren't kidding.

For the long and short of it, the massive influx of newly-introduced Ultimates over the years led to a lot of them evolving from the same Perfect due to the fact that Perfects haven't been expanded on as well (and there's never been a shortage on the number of Adults in the franchise). I think during the time of the Pendulum Z releases, this was noted by someone who was welcoming the introduction of more new Perfects that don't belong to any specific evolution line (I specifically remember them pointing to Digitamamon as an example, which makes sense when you consider that Minervamon and Titamon, at least pre-Rebellimon, seem to have made it their canon Perfect form just for the hell of it, despite already having Devitamamon and I guess the unreleased HolyDigitamamon).

I don’t know if you’re talking about me but I’ve been complaining about how Perfects are the smallest post-Child level for a while.

As noted, it’s especially bereft of female-coded Perfects, leading to the absurdity of Angewomon having at least seven canon Ultimates (Holydramon, Ophanimon, Ophanimon FM, Lovely Angewomon, Mastemon, Venusmon, and Junomon)

 

[Bancho]

I also feel as though LovelyAngemon should have been a Perfect level especially since magic enhanced brawling does not seem very Mega level in strength.

 

[Chimera-gui]

I don’t know if you’re talking about me but I’ve been complaining about how Perfects are the smallest post-Child level for a while.

As noted, it’s especially bereft of female-coded Perfects, leading to the absurdity of Angewomon having at least seven canon Ultimates (Holydramon, Ophanimon, Ophanimon FM, Lovely Angewomon, Mastemon, Venusmon, and Junomon)

To be fair, Mastemon is a Jogress of Angewomon with LadyDevimon, FM ties into Ophanimon, Junomon's range of prior stages was expanded to be any yellow or purple Level V Digimon so Angewomon may no longer be her default anymore.

I also feel as though LovelyAngemon should have been a Perfect level especially since magic enhanced brawling does not seem very Mega level in strength.

The problem is that reducing Lovely's Level leaves Cho-Hakkaimon without many fitting options besides the default Ophanimon and Lilithmon.

Plus MagnaAngemon already has four purely angelic Level VI stages (Seraphimon, Clavis, Slash and Dominimon) giving Angewomon a Level VI "Angemon" form of her own shouldn't be a big deal.

 

[Yamato-san]

I also feel as though LovelyAngemon should have been a Perfect level especially since magic enhanced brawling does not seem very Mega level in strength.

It's clearly a reference to Bandai and Toei's own Precure franchise. I guess aside from not wanting to make it look anything less than an Ultimate, the stakes in some Precure series can get pretty insane (we're talking universe-level threats as the endgame about half the time).

Plus MagnaAngemon already has four purely angelic Level VI stages (Seraphimon, Clavis, Slash and Dominimon) giving Angewomon a Level VI "Angemon" form of her own shouldn't be a big deal.

Slash? I mean, I guess it's possible, but it was associated with Kyukimon upon its debut (and now Shakkoumon, apparently). Calling it a HolyAngemon evolution seems equivalent to calling MetalTyranomon a Greymon evolution.

 

[Chimera-gui]

Slash? I mean, I guess it's possible, but it was associated with Kyukimon upon its debut (and now Shakkoumon, apparently). Calling it a HolyAngemon evolution seems equivalent to calling MetalTyranomon a Greymon evolution.

To be fair, Vikemon was associated with Shakkoumon upon its debut despite being later linked to the Gomamon line.

Plus Slash isn't linked to either Kyukimon or Shakkoumon by name or lore though, it's named for Angemon implying a link with the Angemon-species well before it was ever linked to the former two since the only Digimon with "Ange" in their name to explicitly not be an Angemon-species is MarineAngemon and only because it's meant an angel of the sea variety rather than of the Biblical variety as the Angemon-species are meant to be.