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Thread: 3D Models from Digimon Linkz (and by extension Cyber Sleuth and Next 0rder)

  1. #11
    Completely digital Velocifaptor's Avatar
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    Are these obj/mqo rips, without post-processing, or are these actually rigged? I'm thinking of learning MikuMikuMoving (successor to MMD; both are open source), and I heard some company made an anime with MMD. It would be interesting to do some animation with these models. Fan series maybe? Set in the Tamers continuity?

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamesC View Post
    Wow this is amazing!
    I am not sure I really understand how these are used in Next Order. They are the same models but lower resolution and different shading? Maybe more bones too
    I'm wondering the exact same thing; maybe it's because they have to make field battle animation for each and every single one of those digimons.
    Last edited by DocMelonhead; 03-30-2016 at 04:40 PM.

  3. #13
    Super Moderator Theigno's Avatar
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    So yesterday something interesting happened... if you look at the URLs for the model packages like this one: http://icdn.s3.api.digimonlinkz.chan...2_GO.unity3d?1 you'll see that one of the paths corresponds to the current version of Digimon linkz (1.0.3) yesterday I noticed that there was in fact already data in the directories for version 1.0.4. To be more precise I was checking the package index for character models, incremented the version to 1.0.4 and still got a result. The file is nice enough to not only show what files exist and where they are located but also provide crc checksums for all the files... so when the 1.0.4 table actually showed different check-sums I knew that the files had been changed. So I downloaded them (they were indeed all accessible) and all of them were smaller than the 1.0.3 versions. The reason was because the new models used differently compressed textures. In most cases the texture had only 50% of the filesize compared to the compression in the current version and the results were also quite... different. The current compression has some strange quirks when it comes to artifacting, details can be often be blurry and bright spots sometimes condense into weird bubbly artifacts... the new compression doesn't have those exact problems but also introduces new problems. While details are much clearer now and highlights are actually in the shape they are supposed to be but the color range of the textures took a big hit. Any gradients showed heavy banding and in general colors seemed heavily dithered. When it came to especially contrasting colors the results looked really bad, the edge between a red and a blue section of an image (on Sleipmon's shield for example) tends to look heavily pixelated. Overall I'm not sure if the change would have been worth it... but it's possible that it won't actually be implented since the files disappeared from the server again. So it's possible that it was just a test and the developers are still experimenting with how to handle the files. I kind of hope that they'll end up using some sort of compression that's not as destructive as both the previous ones. But well... if they end up going with one of the two I've already seen then at least I don't need to re-extract anything. (also I'm not putting the "new" textures online as long as there's no proof that they will be used in the game.)

    Quote Originally Posted by djdeathspider View Post
    Are these obj/mqo rips, without post-processing, or are these actually rigged?
    Just read the previous post, it should tell you all about the rigging... in short the obj models aren't rigged but you can extract rigged versions of the models in another format from the unity ressources.
    those don't come with textures so you'd have to reapply those, I did some tests with carrying over selections for multi textured digimon and it seems like the polygon selections sometimes aren't applied perfectly... so it's possible you need to tweak that a bit not that this is much work and you'd probably have to to a lot of selecting and applying materials to different places anyway if you don't want everything to look like plastic.
    But I guess I've been ranting about my annoyances with low effort fanvids enough in that last post...

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesC View Post
    Wow this is amazing!
    I am not sure I really understand how these are used in Next Order. They are the same models but lower resolution and different shading? Maybe more bones too
    Most models I've seen are the same. As far as "resolution" goes it depends on your definition... resolution in terms of the mesh would mean that the models have less polygons, but this is not the case. Mostly what I've seen is only lower resolution in terms of the textures. If the claims of Next 0rder being made in unity are true they could even have used the exact same asset packages we see in Linkz now (although, as I noted before at least their Angewomon model looks better than the one in linkz). And the shading is of course incredibly different, maybe that will mislead some people into believing they are seeing new models even when they don't... overall I'd describe the shading in Next 0rder as "annoyingly shiny". There is however no reason to add more bones to the models. The current models are completely rigged and you could pretty much animate all movements you would need for almost any game (unless it's a toe tickling simulator) and of course infinitely more movements that don't make any biological sense.

    Quote Originally Posted by DocMelonhead View Post
    I'm wondering the exact same thing; maybe it's because they have to make field battle animation for each and every single one of those digimons.
    I doubt animations had anything to do with how the models were handled. Sure weighting and rigging a more complex model takes more time... but those models were already completely finished for Cyber Sleuth and for animation itself you don't screw around with the geometry itself. Animations by themselves also don't take up much space. They are simply instructions of transformations, "point X goes to position Y at frame Z" that is applied to the model, and once the model on the screen and loaded into vram you can pretty much do anything as long as it's reasonable. Sure, you could conceive of an animation so fast and complex that it completely overloads the console when it is executed but that's a completely unrealistic scenario it doesn't matter how many animations a model has (except for engine limitations) there will always be only one on the screen and the graphics can totally manage that.
    I think the actual reason for the lower resolution might lie elsewhere... for example it's possible that Next 0rder has much more levels and open areas than Cyber Sleuth does (but don't quote me on that), if the levels are bigger more things need to be rendered and of course the models for the terrain take up space. That's the stuff that really pushes the gpu and might be the reason why they decided to have lower detail on individual assets this time around.

  4. #14
    Completely digital Velocifaptor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theigno View Post
    but you can extract rigged versions of the models in another format from the unity ressources.
    Not sure how that would work as the file isn't a unitypackage file, and is diminutive compared to the individual models. But then again, I'm a dabbler, not a professional, so I don't know much about this stuff. Will maybe rig the humanoid Digimon using Mixamo Fuse's auto-rigger. With any luck, those should work with MMD/MMM/iClone. Thanks for the heads-up!

  5. #15
    I'm going digital Tortoiseshel's Avatar
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    You're my hero, Theigno! These are so much better than the DMO models!

  6. #16
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    These are fantastic rips! Thank you so much!
    Interesting to see how some of the models are setup in conjunction with the design: Paildramon's shoulder pads seem to restrict full arm movement for example.
    Edit:
    Mangamon's mouth/muzzle! Whao!
    Last edited by Piers; 04-04-2016 at 05:02 PM.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theigno View Post
    Most models I've seen are the same. As far as "resolution" goes it depends on your definition... resolution in terms of the mesh would mean that the models have less polygons, but this is not the case. Mostly what I've seen is only lower resolution in terms of the textures. If the claims of Next 0rder being made in unity are true they could even have used the exact same asset packages we see in Linkz now (although, as I noted before at least their Angewomon model looks better than the one in linkz). And the shading is of course incredibly different, maybe that will mislead some people into believing they are seeing new models even when they don't... overall I'd describe the shading in Next 0rder as "annoyingly shiny". There is however no reason to add more bones to the models. The current models are completely rigged and you could pretty much animate all movements you would need for almost any game (unless it's a toe tickling simulator) and of course infinitely more movements that don't make any biological sense.
    I guess what I meant then was more animations since Digimon World digimon do seem to be able to do alot more compared to the standard of what they did in Digimon Story CS

  8. #18
    Super Moderator Theigno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamesC View Post
    I guess what I meant then was more animations since Digimon World digimon do seem to be able to do alot more compared to the standard of what they did in Digimon Story CS
    But they don't do anything that would require new bones. Like whatever animations BanchouLeomon has in Next 0rder... none of those will need any more moving joints or limbs than he already does for his attack and walking animations in CS.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theigno View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by jamesC View Post
    I guess what I meant then was more animations since Digimon World digimon do seem to be able to do alot more compared to the standard of what they did in Digimon Story CS
    But they don't do anything that would require new bones. Like whatever animations BanchouLeomon has in Next 0rder... none of those will need any more moving joints or limbs than he already does for his attack and walking animations in CS.
    oh yeah I understood that from your 1st post but I was wondering what is this extra functionality that Digimon World Next Order added? Is most of this just new more complex animations to the existing models?

  10. #20
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    Just wanted to thank you so much for this goldmine(hell I made this account on purpose to do so)
    This'll help greatly in a project I'm working on ATM.

    Once again, thank you

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