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Thread: [Digimon Podcast] Lost In Translationmon: Episode 167 - And So It Ends...

  1. #21
    I'm a Maniac Chakmon's Avatar
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    Finished listening to Episode 2 last night, great show, a few comments:

    On Taichi: I thought Jay's take on Tai vs. Taichi was interesting. Jay was spot on when referring to the fact that Tai seems to jump right into his leadership role in the English Version. In the English Version Tai is leader by default. In the Japanese however, Taichi starts off pretty much as a normal boy. He's athletic and outgoing and all, but not like a superman, he's just kind of an Alphakid. Pretty confident, or at least not mired in self-doubt or self-consciousness. In the Japanese, as the first few episodes go along, it really is kind-of a coin toss as to who will really lead the group. Jyou is the eldest and camp leader so he is kind of deferred to as the leader by default, especially given that in Japan, older kids having to look after younger kids is a social given in society. Likewise, Yamato and Taichi rise to the occasion with their own ideas of how the group should go forward with being stranded in the DigiWorld. What I really appreciate in the Japanese is that the story could have almost gone any way, with Jyou, Yamato and Taichi all having good points to be leader. Koshiro and Takeru are too young, and Sora and Mimi are girls, and you're likely not going to get a female leader in a shounen anime. I mean, Taichi is obviously going to be the leader because he's the shounen trope, but he gets elected leader by the group after making some sound decisions and being the one who really gels the kids together. If memory serves, Taichi even kind of reluctantly takes the role with Koromon/Agumon's urging. Taichi isn't like English Tai in that way, where Tai's bowl-you-over personality almost forces everyone to accept he's the leader. The collective agreement that Taichi should lead the group is one of my favorite parts of the beginning, that gets left out of the English Version. All the kids are much more balanced personalities, and I really appreciated the fact that Jyou started out as the default leader, being the eldest, and Jyou, Yamato and Taichi almost had equal claim to the leadership role. Much different from the English Version where Joe is simply incompetent and helpless, and Matt is standoffish and "too cool for school" to really consider leadership.

    The best part of this episode was Jay's theory on Gabumon's fur. That is the best theory I ever heard. Gabumon's fur is a symbioite, and Gabumon is basically a possessed Agumon! Hilarious! His fur coat is a conscious living organism... lol Jay's comments are pretty funny. It's funny to hear Jay comment, not knowing what's coming in future episodes. A perspective us seasoned DigiFans no longer have... He provides a fresh perspective. Hopefully he will last the series. I'm not sure how May is keeping Jay in this podcast, but there is a small sadistic pleasure in watching an adult try and reason through a kids' show that we have an irrational love of.... HA! Hang in there Jay, it gets better (and worse)! Also, Jay's term "Amerikids" was perfect! You have no idea how ridiculously dumbed down kids' programming is here in the U.S. It's basically a byproduct of a society without any real problems, so we get to coddle and obsess over our youth safety for lack of any real concerns domestically (at least concerns we really want to confront as a culture). American kids are probably the most coddled group of human beings on the planet and kids' TV programming is an excellent example. I've boiled it down to three places where the English dub must make changes/insert jokes in order to "work" for American television. (1) any place there is silence, especially for dramatic effect, (2) any place where uncomfortable emotions may be emerging (doubt, fear, mortality, lust, etc.) and (3) any place where a character appears more complex than their assigned stereotype. Some are funny, but the English brand is just SO different from the Japanese.

    I'm with May on my frustrations with Mimi. Yeah, she likes pink, she's a girl, we get it. So she likes, shopping, is weak/spoiled, etc etc etc. It does a real dis-service to the American viewer by denying them more complex characters for their own safety and to secure a proper TV rating to fit the distribution channels. Also, we just like corny humor over dramatic growth I guess... It makes me sad, because I hate to say it, but in the U.S. we really are a nation of stereotypes. The diversity and individualism rampant in the U.S. almost makes stereotyping a requirement because everyone is just too busy and things are going way too fast for anyone to get to know anyone, so we just want to the catch the gist of who you are (your brand) and we can mentally fill-in-the-blanks to fit our own stereotype narratives. That's just an aggregate cultural observation that is stoked by our media, individuals are much more nuanced... Not to be overly negative, but I think recasting characters the way the English version did just reinforces this problem. Although it is a kids' show, maybe I should just lighten up and laugh? But that's another issue with the English vs. Japanese. A lot of the humor is negative in the English. Poking fun at one another, sarcastic, stuff like that. No one appreciates biting sarcasm more than I, but it is overwhelmingly a negative brand of humor that Americans seem to bask in. That's why The Simpsons and South Park come from here. That's kind of our brand of humor in the States. In the Japanese it always felt like the kids were better bonded, cared for one another better and worked as a group a little easier. Although I could have just been too busy reading subtitles and didn't notice. We get a lot of somewhat funny cheap shots on Mimi for lame English jokes, but at what cost to her character, and our reception of her as a character in this group? Why does Joe have to be such a hypochondriac? Although, I must admit that Gomamon and Joe's relationship in the English is really great given their contrasting personalities. It's just frustrating to see more realistic, well-rounded, potentially more complex characters be re-written as more vapid stereotypes for the sake of easy storytelling and ready-made jokes. And more money and work was spent on making these changes. To me, it's a lsser product in many ways. Americans deserve better. We should know we are better than that. This is what Saturday Morning TV is in the U.S., and it boggles my mind that they did the same thing to Digimon Xros Wars, this past year, and Saturday Morning Cartoons don't even exist anymore here, as a thing. Cartoon scheduling being so diluted across times and channels now. What's airing on Nicktoons today as Digimon Fusion, is almost the exact same brand as how Digimon, Digital Monsters aired on Fox Kids back in 1999. Crazy. Jay, keep taking your swipes at Amerikids, maybe someday we will catch on... Thanks for listening to my rant...

    Finally, May had the greatest input in the hopes for Digimon Adventure Tri piece at the beginning. A senpai for Daisuke. YES! I would love to see this! The senpai relationships are one of the things I like most about Digimon and shounen anime in general. Daisuke looking up to Taichi, Takeru to Taichi and Yamato. Frontier is my favorite season, partly because the theme/thread of brotherly love that runs throughout the subs is so endearing. How all the boys help one another grow, particularly Takuya and Tomoki, and how Takuya helps Kouji and Kouichi relate. Even Junpei helps Tomoki grow as a character. That happens a bit in Xros Wars with the Boy Hunters Who Leapt Through Time arc with Tagiru and Taiki, but it never really comes to fruition. Anyways, YES a senpai for Daisuke! Good idea May! I'll be listening for the next show. In the mean time, May, keep Jay strapped to a chair watching both English and Japanese Digimon.... that poor guy... lol You will learn to love it! hahahaha!

  2. #22
    Super Moderator Airdramon's Avatar
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    Thanks for the awesome message!
    I passed it on to Jay who says "That's what I'm going for with my resistance and calling it silly. It should be like the scene in A Clockwork Orange where Alex is locked in the chair with his eyes wedged open. But Digimon."
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  3. #23
    Super Moderator Airdramon's Avatar
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    We're recording episode 3 tonight and goddamit do I have a lot of opinions about Sora and Mimi's change of character in the dub...
    So if anybody has any questions ask them so we can answer on the show!
    "I'm stylin' dude!"

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  4. #24
    I'm a Maniac springogeek's Avatar
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    Can't wait to listen to it! No questions from me this time though
    Decoding the secrets of the EU/Asia D-power, one step at a time: Here
    Currently Raising: Nothing. :(
    RIP: Greymon (DU, 13yrs), Diaboromon (DU, 20yrs)

  5. #25
    Super Moderator Airdramon's Avatar
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    Just finished recording episode 3 so I'll edit it soon!
    "I'm stylin' dude!"

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  6. #26
    Super Moderator Airdramon's Avatar
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    Episode 3 is out!
    In this episode Jay and May cover ‘Biyomon Gets Firepower’ and 'Kabuterimon’s Electro Shocker’ and discuss more character derailment and how the English dub removes story elements because who needs plot?
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  7. #27
    I find it funny that "Digivolve" is more commonly used than the original "Evolve"..

  8. #28
    Super Moderator Airdramon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockmanX View Post
    I find it funny that "Digivolve" is more commonly used than the original "Evolve"..
    I grew up with the dub so I've spent a lot of my life saying 'Digivolve'.
    I've also been listening to the other Digimon podcasts which focus entirely on the dubs and they use the English terms.
    I usually use the Japanese stages though because of virtual pets.
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  9. #29
    I'm a Maniac springogeek's Avatar
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    Ohh, listening to this later tonight or tomorrow. Can't wait!
    Decoding the secrets of the EU/Asia D-power, one step at a time: Here
    Currently Raising: Nothing. :(
    RIP: Greymon (DU, 13yrs), Diaboromon (DU, 20yrs)

  10. #30
    Super Moderator Airdramon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by springogeek View Post
    Ohh, listening to this later tonight or tomorrow. Can't wait!
    Let me know how we did for episode 3! I'm really hoping we can improve more.
    "I'm stylin' dude!"

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