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Thread: [Digimon Podcast] Lost In Translationmon: Episode 145 - Birdplane

  1. #1041
    Super Moderator Airdramon's Avatar
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    Special 36 - DanDan Revolution
    Digimon Adventure Tri has come to an end, we talk about our highlights and May tries to stay as positive as possible and Jay's glad it's finally over.
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  2. #1042
    Junior Commander DBxDigimon_fan's Avatar
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    So

    You should discuss that Twitter post since you missed on discussing it in the special. It hints at the future of a new "project" and whatnot. Wonder what you guys think it is. There are a lot of different ideas out there about what it could be!

    1 thing about the latest podcast: You guys talked about Tri not being needed to connect 02 to the epilogue, and you're right. It never was needed for that. You used Yamato becoming an astronaut as an example and I think it made sense from the very beginning. They used to have these lil bios for each character back in S1. Part of Yamato's was:
    A cool boy who excels in both academics and sports. His parents divorced three years ago and he now lives with his father. He can be very serious and has a strong sense of responsibility, so is sometimes overly cautious in exploring the Digital World.
    "excels in academics and sports" - Now the reason this is so important is because to become an astronaut you have to be both pretty smart and physically fit. Remember back in the third episode of S1 where he had to swim over to Takeru and save him from Seadramon? He just dove in like it was nothing, and he was pretty quick; and even with an adrenaline rush you'd still have to be pretty fit to maneuver across a body of water like that. And that's just when he was 10! Imagine when he has to take that swimming test (as all astronauts must do to pass) about 25 years later!
    There are generally 2 types of astronauts: Mission specialists and commanders. Mission specialists have to be pretty damn intelligent, like Koushiro intelligent. And I don't think that's Yamato. So could he become a commander? I think its possible. Most astronauts come out of the military. So perhaps after high school he could join the military. You might think this is at odds with his musician lifestyle of his teenage years. Well, for one the live play he said he'd rather not be a musician as a career because it would make it unenjoyable and so he'd rather keep it as a hobby. Besides, if Taichi can grow up and change schools based on his career path set forth in the epilogue, I think Yamato could do the same and join the military. Also, his crest is of friendship and the military is also meant to foster camaraderie; you know that thing that was a major part of his growth as a character in the Adventure series. I think the military is a perfect fit for Yamato. The only other thing this would require him to do on this path to becoming an astronaut is become a pilot within the military. And if he's already made it to joining the military, I think he could most definitely do that.
    I laughed out loud in Tri when he said "Maybe I'll look to space then." I don't think it was a last minute decision by the writing team and I don't think they ever didn't-know how they were gonna tie him in as an astronaut. I just think they didn't bother trying since its such a hard career path as it is it would take the entire 22 years after Tri to explain how he got there. You just have to imagine it for yourself. And so they threw that little joke in there for fun. That's what I think anyway.

    As for what Tri is, I think its neither "a waste of time" nor that it was meant to explain everything about Adventure's loose ends. I think it was exactly what the last Adventure movie was, part of the story that takes place after the events of 02 but before the epilogue that are just meant to be awesome. Besides, it very well may lead to another series. Like how the 02 kids weren't in action, maybe they are saving them for this new "project" they're working on, you know marketing and all that... I just don't think it was meant to be the end-all-be-all Digimon series so many expected it to be. Its movies. Its for fun. Its to see how people still feel about Adventure. Which it turns out it appears a lot of people have come out of the shadows to watch Tri, so this might open the flood gates to a new series following Tri. Perhaps they'll take a crack at that space battle they had planned after 02... Who knows? Tri just seems more like a setup to me than a proper ending.

  3. #1043
    I'm going digital McGann's Avatar
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    On Tri:

    One thing I really liked about Tri was how it explored growing up in relation to nostalgia. Reunion denies us a full visceral thrill of a Digimon battle, because it's constantly reminding us of the collateral damage that conflict causes.

    Some characters are held back by nostalgia, others driven by it. It's only when they find the right balance that they're able to progress. It's especially well-shown with Daigo and Maki, with one being consumed by yearning for the past, to the point where it destroy them and hurts those around them, while the other is driven by memories of his childhood to sacrifice himself for the next generation.

    Also, I'm not sure if this is intentional, but the scene when they kill Ordinemon heavily parallels the scene from Reunion where they save her (the way it cuts to everyone's frustrated reaction shots). Except, this time Tai is the one who's certain of what needs to be done, and Matt needs reassurance.

    Tri did feel a little bit like filler the way it ended with the status quo re-enforced, but that can happen a lot in real life; when you struggle, falter, but come out the other end a similar but slightly wiser person. And the relationship to Homeostasis at the very least is a significant change. I think Jay was right that the slow release didn't do the series any favours. That combined with it being a film series perhaps created an expectation for some wider spread consequences to the story, outside the character drama it turned out to be. But as character drama, and exploration of the struggle of growing up, I enjoyed Tri, messy as it was.

    If there's more, I really hope to Christ it's a weekly series.

    On your gripes:

    I think the base belonged to Maki. She's the only one who wouldn't want the kids dead but would want them out of the way, and if she ever needed to cheese it, that would explain the real world ejection / evil self-destruct protocol. AND why there was only one extra pod. Still doesn't explain how they fell down there though >.>

    I think Alphamon mostly made sense. He was a lackey. In the first film he was trying to provoke Meicoomon into a rage, which Maki later succeeds in the next film. Why he seems content to incapacitate his enemies rather than kill them is confusing given who he's working for, so there could be more going on under the hood.

    However, I struggle to rationalize the scene where he crushes a Kuwagamon that's attacking Garurumon. If he's their enemy, why would he help them? If he wants to frenzy Meicoomon to spread the infection, why would he care about dealing with the infected? If this was a well thought out scene, we can only ascertain that keeping the kids and their Digimon alive was part of the plan. In which case, was stealing the black cube (/Apocalymon Shard) the real plan? And did his shards create Diaboromon and Daemon?

    My gripes:

    Like Jay, I found the lack of clarification on what the Reboot would do to society frustrating. (I assume restore to factory settings / Amish mode?) Tri often had issues with clarification, perhaps some degree by design. But the scene where Ordinemon is splitting in two quite hard to understand. They say she's taking back order, which seems like a good thing, but then something goes wrong I guess?

    The way Gatomon was freed by Jesmon made me think the same was possible for Meicoomon, so I really wasn't expecting her to die. Especially since I was interpretting her plight as struggling with mental illness (what with the Apocalymon shard and Meiko being pretty depressed (like I know Co-existence is a pain with all the Meiko focus, but sometimes looking after a friend who's depressed really does require a lot of moral support)) and they'd end up saving her. Obviously this wasn't the intention of Tri, as that would imply the endorsement of euthanizing the mentally ill.

    Maybe it got lost in the wording, but I felt like Kari's arc fell flat. It would have been more satisfying if she too came to the conclusion that Meicoomon needed to be put down like a rabid dog, and backed Tai up even though everyone else was unsure. Instead there's some implied conflict and rift between the siblings that never yields any significant fallout on-screen.

    Stray Observations:

    I like to think Hackmon's really grown to like the kids and empathize with them through his spying. Like he was there watching Joe and Mimi along with Kari basically having the same reaction.

    It's unclear if every single Digimon got their memories back, but if they did, I feel sorry for Tapirmon who now tragically remembers Maki, but can't see her again.

    EDIT: I appreciate that every partner stage got a decent amount of exposure, even if the power gap between levels got a little loose.

    I didn't need another Omnimon, but I like the fact that it puts the burden of killing Meicoomon on everyone's shoulders. I just would have preferred if he adopted a few more attributes of the other Digimon. Like a Kabuteri-horn or a tail-feather-like waist robe.

    Ordinemon has a really nice roar.

    Overall rating: ( 3 > 1 = 2 = 6 > 4 > 5 ) < Stage Play!
    Last edited by McGann; 05-10-2018 at 10:35 AM.
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  4. #1044
    I'm a Maniac Chakmon's Avatar
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    Adventure Tri 6

    Before watching Our Future I had to re-watch Coexistence because I had only seen it once, and forgot what happened and where the story left off... On the re-watch I have to say I didn't find Co-existence to be all that bad in terms of comforting Meiko. It didn't seem too overdone on this recent re-watch IMO. In fact, I found the part where Taichi gets angry with Meiko for being so down on herself to be pretty sweet. On the series overall, I'd say it's worth watching for Digimon fans, but I agree with everyone that the extended time release of each movie didn't do any favors to the overall story. I'd have to know more about this method of media release in Japan, and if the quality of story that we got is more-or-less par for the course with similar franchises being revisited for an anniversary special mini series. Like everything Digimon, it boils-down to being a gimmick to promote toy and action figure sales, this time more expensive since everyone is now older with more purchasing power.... Over the course of Adventure Tri I've managed to acquire: Adventure Taichi w/ Agumon, Tri Taichi, Yamato, Takeru w/ Patamon/PicoDevimon, Daisuke (favorite), Takato, and Yamato/Takeru (brothers figure) (still being shipped from Japan) for those GEM series figures.... so... mission accomplished. I'm actually kind of bummed that no Takuya, Masaru, Taiki, Tagiru (wanted soooo badly) or Haru seem to be forthcoming....
    What I liked about Our Future was basically two things:
    1. The idea that a partner Digimon can "save you or drive you mad". As this movie progressed I started wondering if maybe Taichi was headed down Maki's route of madness since he was so longing for his past self, adventures and friends, and seemed stuck and unable to move forward. If it wasn't for his friends today, and especially Hikari keeping him going day-to-day, I wonder if Taichi might have ended up in a place similar to Maki. Our Future made me think about their parallels....
    2. I'm so glad they didn't make that last phone call to Meiko a date request by Taichi (if this was an American flick that probably would have been the formula) I know it's a small thing... but I'm so glad they just left that alone.... I actually thought the ending was kind of sweet. Bittersweet and rushed, but sweet all the same.


    Things I didn't like (in order of importance):
    1. If the Zero Two kids pieced the plan together and that's why they were taken out, why wasn't Takeru and Hikari included? They are just as much a part of this group as they were the Adventure crew, so I find it really hard to believe they weren't in on investigating/learning about this. I can't dismiss this contrived premise. It really bugged me, as did the lack of concern for the Zero Two kids' whereabouts throughout. Yes they were told they were fine.... but... I would have been more concerned...
    2. Lame/rushed Zero Two resolution. No middle school Daisuke appearance at all?! I can't really say I'm surprised, since it was an Adventure tale after all, and the Zero Two cast is just in the way, but I still secretly wished Daisuke was going to ride-in on Lighdramon and save everyone in the end... now that's a five-star flick!
    3. Maki being lost to the surf of the Dark Ocean. No! I'm very unhappy with how Maki ended. I have so many questions... can't we save her?? As someone who is probably closer in age to the original group of chosen children I felt a bit of attachment/comradery with Daigo and Maki once we learned they were part of this legendary original group of kids. The reveal was awesome in Loss. I really hate how both of their stories ended. And I really hate how Daigo was just unable to get through to Maki.
    4. Meicoomon's death. Meiko deserved better. We deserved better. She should have been able to be saved.
    5. "Did Taichi die?!" cliffhanger. Even if the epilogue didn't exist, I don't think anyone thought Taichi was ever in any real danger of dying. This should not have been attempted with this character. I didn't deliver.
    6. Hikari's breakdown. Seemed out of character to me, though I also wasn't concerned Taichi was dead, so Hikari's reaction and the aftermath didn't suck me in to the story.


    For May's ranking request, I think I would vote (best to worst): 2-4-1-3-5-6 (3 was really good, but the Daigo/Maki origin sold me on 4, and I really liked 1 as an introduction; 2 gave me Taichi fanservice, so that's an obvious first place; I have to say 6 was so half-baked as an ending with it's forced premises that I had to rank it below 5. As a finale, it was tasked to deliver on a higher level, and kind of failed.)

    What would I like to see next? Adventure Zero. Now that we know some of the original kids, I'd like a prequel anime to tell their story. I'd also take an Adventure 2.5 anime. The kids from the epilogue in their own adventure may soften people's hatred of the Zero Two epilogue if we can see some of their adventures with their Digimon. I'd really like to get to know the Adventure 2.5 kids.

    On previous comments:
    DBxDigimon_fan, that is an awesome premise for Yamato's path to becoming an astronaut! While it's hard for me to see him in the Self Defense Force, it does make sense as a path forward, and the groundwork is there in a subtle way. I honestly don't hate the epilogue as much as most, and really have no problem with Yamato being an astronaut.... why not? Adventure Tri setting Taichi up for wanting to "build a better world" and eventually becoming a diplomat, I thought was pretty decent. But I don't like having to kill off Daigo to achieve it.
    McGann, I pretty much agree with everything, especially Hackmon! And Hikari definitely fell flat.
    Kachikachi Kocchin!

  5. #1045
    Super Moderator Airdramon's Avatar
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    I really enjoy hearing how different everyone's rankings are!
    Also, yeah, Stage Play was better than anything in the rest of Tri in my opinion too, McGann.

    Episode 144 - Beelzemon All New All Different

    We're back from our brief Adventure into Tri!
    Baalmon comes back to life to dig some plotholes and be edgy and Lucemon is back! Is he evil? Of course he is!
    This time, May loves Digimon great and small and Jay loves celebrity impressions.
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  6. #1046
    I'm going digital McGann's Avatar
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    The Paradise mini-arc is one of my personal favourites of Xros. I like the zone environment, and I think the episodes have a nice pace to them; The comical first part with the Schwarzenegger police chase building into some more dramatic moments in parts 2 and 3.
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  7. #1047
    I'm a Maniac Chakmon's Avatar
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    Xros Wars 14-15-16

    Ep. 14 - I have to say I really like how Mugendramon is like Lillithmon's puppy in this episode with the pink collar. I love it! I also liked HiMugendramon.
    Did anyone else notice after Taiki left Ba'almon to save the others the SUPER GLOSSY animation of his DigiXros lead-in? I think it's the first of many. It's so jarring.

    Ep. 15 - I like the Heaven Zone too. Sadly it's the first zone that loses the "digital" effects animations added to the settings though. The settings just become generic world settings, something people took issue with in Frontier. But it makes me think, what would be required to make it a "digital world" setting? Could it only be a Tron-like setting? Or the awesome Internet world of Diablomon Strikes Back? I honestly like Pagasusmon and his Star Shower attack, so it was fun to see him in this episode too! SlushAngemon? Everything that needs to be said about this has already been said a million times. Bad dub!

    Ep. 16 - DarkKnightmon's first statement in this show "I am but a noble." was perfect! I forgot that happened. So, what I'm scared about with Xros Wars is this: I always thought the villain in this series was excellent! It totally delivered! Probably the best bad guy in the series. And I'm afraid Jay will pop this illusion with that pesky truth of his... I previously liked Kurata as a baddie in Savers, and Jay exposed the stupidity of him as a character... Is my like of the Xros Wars villain just an illusion where I have filled-in the gaps, glaring plot holes and character chasms with my own wacky imagination??? Will Jay expose Xros Wars' baddie as garbage like Kurata turned out to be??? I hope not... I'm afraid to keep watching.... by the end of this podcast I may become Chakmon Falldown Mode and be a totally lame emo Digimon fanboy.... so dark....

    Daipenmon was the Digimon Data Corner DigiMelody of the week! Sweet! His attacks are Blue Hawaiian Death and Strawberry Death (dub: Purple Plague and Song of Thunder)!? Yes! Yes to all this! I love Daipenmon! May, Jay is TOTALLY wrong on the DigiMelody being dumb. It's the best idea Xros Wars brought to the franchise! And a rather brilliant way to tie the show to more effective use of the Xros Loader toy IMO. I almost feel this is a worthy Digimon Rumble Arena topic if only to see a total knockout of Jay on this topic (with your wit and debate skills of course...) DigiMelody is cute and adds sound to the overall digital aesthetic of this world! TKO!

    P.S. - I totally agree, the stage play was the GEM of this entire Digimon Adventure Tri project. If only I could own a licensed Region 1 subbed DVD of this production. This effort deserves way more money than I have already thrown at Shout/Toei Animation for the six movies, but I have no channel to express my love.... (story of my life...)
    Kachikachi Kocchin!

  8. #1048
    Super Moderator Airdramon's Avatar
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    I love when DarkKnightmon introduces himself as "I am but a noble" idk, it reminds me of Dukemon being all formal.
    And yeah! Digimelodies for life!

    Episode 145 - Birdplane

    May continues to love both Sparrowmon and the DigiMelodies and Jay wonders if May is just enjoying episodes because of Sparrowmon.
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