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View Full Version : Xros Wars Episode 52: Bagra Brother! Bonds of Darkness



Vande
09-03-2011, 04:24 AM
Xros Wars Episode 52 Premiere

Episode thread for Episode 52 of Xros Wars, will be unlocked before airring.

Air Time
6.30am Sunday - (JST) - Japan
10.30pm Saturday - (BST) - UK
05:30pm Saturday (EST) - East Coast
04:30pm Saturday (CST) - Central
02:30pm Saturday (PST) - West Coast

No spoilers past this episode.

To join the chatroom to discuss the episode as it airs and after it airs with others either click the chat link at the top of WtW or use your irc program to join.

Server- irc.rizon.net
Room- #wtw

Vande
09-10-2011, 07:10 AM
Opening the topic as the episode airs today in Japan. No posting until during/after the episode please.

Soluble Toast
09-10-2011, 03:00 PM
episode was better than expected.
Tactimon's sword playing a part was interesting. I'll be waiting for the subs to see what was said about it.

The Digi Xros between BagramonxDarkKnightmon looked too DKnightmon dominant to be DarknessBagramon, but what looked to be DarknessBagramon appeared at the end of the preview for the next ep.
V-Tamer Demon role for Bagramon looking likely?

Ritdracmon
09-10-2011, 03:05 PM
DarkKnightmon stabbing Bagramon was quite...a disruption. Did Bagramon even know about his younger brother's "traitorous" thoughts?

Inpu
09-10-2011, 03:07 PM
Perfect episode, though like Seymour, I wish Bagramon hadn't gone down like a beyotch.

Rynnec
09-10-2011, 03:23 PM
Not having seen the episode yet, did Darkknightmon and Baguramon even have a proper fight?

lucemon
09-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Xros wars without flaws in the plot! 100% perfect!

*It was explained what happened with the sword of TACTIMON in the real world!
*They explained and showed the scene, as Kiriha, was taken to the Digital World!
*They explained everything about the D5!

Crocodile Cacophony
09-10-2011, 03:47 PM
Being the DarkKnightmon fanboy that I am, I couldn't be happier with what transpired in this episode. I felt that the use of his insert song was absolutely perfect in every way. It was well worth the song's omission (save for an instrumental taste in episode 16) from the series up until this point.

Seymour Butz
09-10-2011, 03:52 PM
Tac-chan‼

Tac-chan is back‼ Well, sort of! Maybe! Ani-Ue went straight for him, and we got to hear his voice! Ohhh my goodness, what could this mean? ×ros Wars is scripted pretty tightly within each mini-arc, and there are not a lot of unnecessary asides, so I have to think that Tac-chan is actually going to be, you know, relevant. He seems to have been absorbed by Ani-Ue, but why did everything turn to stone? I doubt that he would be trying to stop his emperor, and the whole area turning to stone does not really help the citizens of Earth. On the other hand, Dark Knightmon seems to be in control of the body now, and I doubt that Tac-chan will take kindly to being inside a body controlled by that asshole, especially if their minds link enough for him to find out what happened to Lili-chan and Blastmon, let alone Dark Knightmon's betrayal of Ani-Ue. I would not be surprised if he turned on him and they fought it out within Darkness Bagramon's mind; perhaps Tac-chan will win and the final enemy will be a new form when he takes over (maybe even the same form that would result from Dark Knightmon trying to absorb Tac-chan in the manga). I did notice, however, that in the preview, Darkness Bagramon had Dark Knightmon's head rather than Bagramon's, which makes me think of Belphemon / Kurata, and makes me believe that Bagramon is going to take back over Darkness Bagramon, in which case Tac-chan's consciousness rebelling seems less likely … unless he still finds out about his former comrades, and feels betrayed enough to turn on his former master? Would the writers think it a good idea for Bagramon to suffer insubordination twice in two or three episodes? I am in total fan boy mode regardless, and extremely anxious to see what comes next.

Soluble Toast
09-10-2011, 04:00 PM
As much as I love Tactimon, I can't see anything coming from this. It just looks like Bagramon absorbed the mass amount of Digital energy Tactimon collected while in the real world, which he may or may not have transferred to his sword while powering up his ultimate attack.

Episode 30:
Tactimon: My ultimate sword took the immense power of this world and is now invincible.

Tactimon's sword surviving did mean something: It was left there to provide Bagramon the digital power of the human world. I think it ends there though. I can't see Tactimon being revived, or even being brought up again after this episode.

Seymour Butz
09-10-2011, 04:41 PM
As much as I love Tactimon, I can't see anything coming from this. It just looks like Bagramon absorbed the mass amount of Digital energy Tactimon collected while in the real world, which he may or may not have transferred to his sword while powering up his ultimate attack.

Episode 30:
Tactimon: My ultimate sword took the immense power of this world and is now invincible.

Tactimon's sword surviving did mean something: It was left there to provide Bagramon the digital power of the human world. I think it ends there though. I can't see Tactimon being revived, or even being brought up again after this episode.


But they could just as easily have had Bagramon absorb it all himself; there was no need for Tac-chan's sword to play a role, much less for it to speak in his voice. The writers of ×ros Wars have generally avoided complicated scenarios when not strictly necessary, to the point of forgoing far more obvious opportunities to incorporate past occurrences into present ones (for example, how many times did the San Gen Shi even acknowledge knowing Beelzebumon or Dorulumon?). I certainly see your point, and if it pertained to a more nuanced and intelligent series it would be a very good one, but with respect, for this series it seems like an utterly needless extravagance if they are not going to go anywhere further with it. Even if you are right though, I am still tickled pink that the damn writers actually remembered Tac-chan's existence for the second time since his death.

Absolute Zero
09-10-2011, 06:07 PM
I see a Black BishopChessmon, too bad that the RookChessmon is still the black one.
So... Gravimon isn't lying about Bagramon's the one who call Kiriha to the digital world?
Meh... DarkKnightmon, i know that's his nature... but stabbing his brother while he's fighting the enemy? i just got tired of his nature...

Bartz
09-10-2011, 06:40 PM
But they could just as easily have had Bagramon absorb it all himself; there was no need for Tac-chan's sword to play a role, much less for it to speak in his voice. The writers of ×ros Wars have generally avoided complicated scenarios when not strictly necessary, to the point of forgoing far more obvious opportunities to incorporate past occurrences into present ones (for example, how many times did the San Gen Shi even acknowledge knowing Beelzebumon or Dorulumon?). I certainly see your point, and if it pertained to a more nuanced and intelligent series it would be a very good one, but with respect, for this series it seems like an utterly needless extravagance if they are not going to go anywhere further with it. Even if you are right though, I am still tickled pink that the damn writers actually remembered Tac-chan's existence for the second time since his death.


Honestly, I think the writers don't really care that much and instead, they had the sword there just to tie up a loose end. That loose end being that since Tacimon's sword had the digital energy of the human world, Bagramon absorbed the sword along with the rest of the energy to increase his power, nothing more than that. Besides, even if there's supposed to be more to it, I really can't see the writers giving Tactimon too much more of a role than they've already given him, much less have him overthrow two important villains that we've been building up to.

Anyway, back to the episode:

-I'm glad they finally addressed how Kiriha came to the Digital world, but really, it was a little too late for that. They really should've done it earlier in any of the three arcs devoted to him, but instead, they give him a minor scene that explains very little about it, at least when compared to Nene/Yuu. As for Bagramon bringing him to the Digital world, I'm going to wait until the Sub comes out to talk more in detail, but I'm not too thrilled about it right now either.

-Not surprised in the slightest DarkKnightmon backstabbed his brother like that, especially considering that he did the same to everyone else. One thing I do like though is that unlike the DarknessBagramon we've seen, it's more DarkKnightmon oriented, which gives me hope that Bagramon will become dominant again and retake his position as the final antagonist.

-Interesting that they have the Examon and Wargreymon digimelodies in the title card when we haven't seen them at all so far and when the hell is Taiki going to use that Veemon Digimelody?

Seymour Butz
09-10-2011, 06:43 PM
Shit, I just realised, it was probably Omegamon talking instead of Tac-chan, as they share the same voice actor. Argh. Well, still, the rest of my point stands. I really do think that he will be coming back. They bothered to give him screen text, which is more than Ba'almon got in his flashback in episode forty-seven (or any of the Death Generals got in this episode), although the fact that he was merely labelled as Bagra Army, and not as one of the San Gen Shi, might be telling that his time is past. We shall see.

TMS
09-10-2011, 08:33 PM
Just watched a "medium quality" version. The DarkKnightmon/Bagramon Xros looks like DarknessBagramon, but the head is still DarkKnightmon's, and it's missing the chest skull. I wonder if we'll get a name for it. I trust it isn't DarknessDarkKnightmon.

Also, did we get a new Digimon during the eyecatch?

Finally, I like the gigantic Yuu-powered Tyutyumon in the preview.

Bartz
09-10-2011, 09:12 PM
Just watched a "medium quality" version. The DarkKnightmon/Bagramon Xros looks like DarknessBagramon, but the head is still DarkKnightmon's, and it's missing the chest skull. I wonder if we'll get a name for it. I trust it isn't DarknessDarkKnightmon.

Also, did we get a new Digimon during the eyecatch?

Finally, I like the gigantic Yuu-powered Tyutyumon in the preview.


We did, here's Soundbirdmon (http://i.imgur.com/rrxBJ.jpg)

WereGarurumon
09-10-2011, 09:25 PM
Oh yes, cat vs. mouse next ep!

And man, DKmon, you lovable bastard!

Inpu
09-11-2011, 12:11 AM
Honestly, I think the writers don't really care that much and instead, they had the sword there just to tie up a loose end. That loose end being that since Tacimon's sword had the digital energy of the human world, Bagramon absorbed the sword along with the rest of the energy to increase his power, nothing more than that. Besides, even if there's supposed to be more to it, I really can't see the writers giving Tactimon too much more of a role than they've already given him, much less have him overthrow two important villains that we've been building up to.

Anyway, back to the episode:

-I'm glad they finally addressed how Kiriha came to the Digital world, but really, it was a little too late for that. They really should've done it earlier in any of the three arcs devoted to him, but instead, they give him a minor scene that explains very little about it, at least when compared to Nene/Yuu. As for Bagramon bringing him to the Digital world, I'm going to wait until the Sub comes out to talk more in detail, but I'm not too thrilled about it right now either.

-Not surprised in the slightest DarkKnightmon backstabbed his brother like that, especially considering that he did the same to everyone else. One thing I do like though is that unlike the DarknessBagramon we've seen, it's more DarkKnightmon oriented, which gives me hope that Bagramon will become dominant again and retake his position as the final antagonist.

-Interesting that they have the Examon and Wargreymon digimelodies in the title card when we haven't seen them at all so far and when the hell is Taiki going to use that Veemon Digimelody?



There is also a DORUmon DigiMemory there, which hasn't been released or even hinted about before.

Vande
09-11-2011, 12:16 AM
In relation to that Dorumon Digimemory, that could have been the V-mon one that we saw twice (aka animation error)

Seems like a lot of stuff kicked off in this episode then, can't wait to see it.

Inpu
09-11-2011, 12:29 AM
In relation to that Dorumon Digimemory, that could have been the V-mon one that we saw twice (aka animation error)

Seems like a lot of stuff kicked off in this episode then, can't wait to see it.


It says, in katakana "Dorumon", with an attack "Metal Cannon".

We can't see the image, sure, but...that's enough for me to count it as revealing a DORUmon DigiMemory.

CloneWarrior
09-11-2011, 07:06 AM
It says, in katakana "Dorumon", with an attack "Metal Cannon".

We can't see the image, sure, but...that's enough for me to count it as revealing a DORUmon DigiMemory.


Here's the full image without the title over it. (http://oi56.tinypic.com/jrxlrb.jpg)

Vande
09-11-2011, 07:38 AM
It says, in katakana "Dorumon", with an attack "Metal Cannon".
We can't see the image, sure, but...that's enough for me to count it as revealing a DORUmon DigiMemory.


What i'm saying is remember when Revolmon handed over the Digimemories to Taiki and then Bastemon handed over hers. There were x2 sets of V-Mon memories. I'm thinking it's possible one should have been Dorumon.

The Chaos Entity
09-11-2011, 10:34 AM
Possible, but it still doesn't explain Examon and WarGreymon, and I think there were 2 Gatomon too.

garfield15
09-11-2011, 01:31 PM
So much explained in this episode. And Akari/Zenjirou are back! Yay!

Also, did Baguramon mention something about Tactimon when the sword got removed?

Seymour Butz
09-11-2011, 02:16 PM
Also, did Baguramon mention something about Tactimon when the sword got removed?


Just that he would fulfil his subordinate's wish to take over or destroy the human world, or something like that. I do not think that either the sword or the digital energy that Tac-chan had absorbed were mentioned directly.

Inpu
09-11-2011, 02:19 PM
What i'm saying is remember when Revolmon handed over the Digimemories to Taiki and then Bastemon handed over hers. There were x2 sets of V-Mon memories. I'm thinking it's possible one should have been Dorumon.

Oh, cool. Yeah, I'm just saying that this reveals the existence of a Dorumon DigiMemory within the Digimon Franchise, not necessarily that Taiki has it.

CloneWarrior
09-11-2011, 02:52 PM
Possible, but it still doesn't explain Examon and WarGreymon, and I think there were 2 Gatomon too.


Darkdramon was the other duplicate.

The DigiMemories Taiki received were:

KingWhamon (Island Zone)

Agumon
Garurumon
HolyAngemon
MarineAngemon
Leviamon


Revolmon (Sand Zone)

Patamon
V-mon
Guilmon
Darkdramon


Pinocchimon (Dust Zone)

MetalGarurumon


Bastemon (Digital Space)

V-mon (Duplicate)
Impmon
Tailmon
Darkdramon (Duplicate)

Inpu
09-11-2011, 05:36 PM
Darkdramon was the other duplicate.

The DigiMemories Taiki received were:

KingWhamon (Island Zone)

Agumon
Garurumon
HolyAngemon
MarineAngemon
Leviamon


Revolmon (Sand Zone)

Patamon
V-mon
Guilmon
Darkdramon


Pinocchimon (Dust Zone)

MetalGarurumon


Bastemon (Digital Space)

V-mon (Duplicate)
Impmon
Tailmon
Darkdramon (Duplicate)




I'm not sure that V-mon and Darkdramon were duplicates -- I think Bastemon just got a hold of them somehow. Doesn't she say she forgot she was holding on to them?

Also, about you guys thinking it was Omegamon or Tactimon talking -- the cast list says it was Examon.

WereGarurumon
09-11-2011, 07:14 PM
That was Examon? Man, Bin Shimada has so many side characters going for him.

Inpu
09-11-2011, 08:15 PM
That was Examon? Man, Bin Shimada has so many side characters going for him.

Its Nobutoshi Canna, actually.

WereGarurumon
09-11-2011, 08:54 PM
But the one we heard was definitely Bin Shimada's voice. Huh, weird.

TMS
09-11-2011, 09:24 PM
Examon? Where the hell did he come from?

onkeikun
09-11-2011, 11:34 PM
Just confirming that emperor dude is voiced by Kiriha's voice actor.

Inpu
09-11-2011, 11:35 PM
Just confirming that emperor dude is voiced by Kiriha's voice actor.

Right, it said that in the asahi summary.

onkeikun
09-12-2011, 12:36 AM
That makes life easier.

Anyway, nothing surprising about this episode, even to someone not following spoilers.

Absolute Zero
09-12-2011, 01:10 AM
Wow.. Examon? Then there's a chance that we'll get to see DORUmon's and WarGreymon's digimemory appearing out of nowhere in the next episode.

Tyranno
09-12-2011, 05:47 AM
I thoroughly enjoyed this episode.

Holydramon
09-12-2011, 06:45 AM
I hope it's really Examon...I want to see him animated >_<

Inpu
09-12-2011, 08:19 AM
I hope it's really Examon...I want to see him animated >_<

Examon was definitely the one shouting at Zenjirou and Akari.

Also--it's probably a long shot, but did anyone happen to see a King or Queen among the black Chessmons?

CloneWarrior
09-12-2011, 08:27 AM
Also--it's probably a long shot, but did anyone happen to see a King or Queen among the black Chessmons?


Nope, just Pawns, Knights, Rooks and Bishops.

Deviate
09-12-2011, 11:35 AM
Bravo to Toei for properly introducing BishopChessmon Black. Here's hoping we see Black King and Queen in the next episode as Bagura's final cannon fodder.

Inpu
09-12-2011, 11:43 AM
Bravo to Toei for properly introducing BishopChessmon Black. Here's hoping we see Black King and Queen in the next episode as Bagura's final cannon fodder.


Ha. It would be kind of funny if Bandai would clean up the loose ends too -- releasing one promo set for all the ended card games that included all the Digimon who were referenced in the card games but never actually made available.

Daydream, I know.

Deviate
09-12-2011, 12:30 PM
Besides the missing Chessmons and I believe one X-Antibody Digimon from the 1st card game, are there any others?

Inpu
09-12-2011, 02:28 PM
Besides the missing Chessmons and I believe one X-Antibody Digimon from the 1st card game, are there any others?

Not so sure about the Japanese card games, but there's a few loose ends in the Digi-Battle Card Game, and Super Digica Taisen needs to bloody give me the remaining DigiMemory cards. It...hurts me to have a table with empty spaces like that.

Exiled
09-13-2011, 02:22 AM
Is no surprise see a BishopChessmon Black, when the same series have other recolors, like Grademon Black and LadyDevimon Red.

Absolute Zero
09-13-2011, 03:27 AM
Is no surprise see a BishopChessmon Black, when the same series have other recolors, like Grademon Black and LadyDevimon Red.

Well the thing about BishopChessmon(Black) is that's not another random recolor that come out of nowhere like the others, but it's already on a card i think (Da-455) and also the reason why BishopChessmon(White) is called BishopChessmon(White) was because there's already BishopChessmon(Black) even before he appeared on Xros Wars. The same also applied to RookChessmon since there's both white and black version of it.

WereGarurumon
09-14-2011, 10:20 PM
Did they mention how long (human world time) was the gap between Akari and Zenjirou's last appearance and this episode? It seems like it was on the same day that Taiki left.

TMS
09-14-2011, 10:35 PM
It very well could have been. Their first trip to the Digital World took up less than a day.

WereGarurumon
09-14-2011, 11:37 PM
Now that I think about it, Taiki's mom was also there at the same time in the same outfit... wait a minute, why is Taiki's mom jogging barefoot?!

Unknown Neo
09-15-2011, 04:45 PM
Are any digiworld set by Earth time or is it just different time. What about Adventure's after the end of 01?

CloneWarrior
09-15-2011, 05:10 PM
Are any digiworld set by Earth time or is it just different time. What about Adventure's after the end of 01?


Zero Two's, Tamers', and Savers' Digital Worlds all ran at the same time as their respective human worlds.

TMS
09-15-2011, 05:16 PM
And Next, if you count the mangas.

Unknown Neo
09-16-2011, 04:32 PM
For wiki's sake, I'd have to. But thanks. The talk about it in the episode made me think of it.

Sabrblade
09-21-2011, 11:12 AM
Excellent episode. So much when on, and so much was awesome.

Bagramon: "Tactimon's will has guided me there." - That's all that was said of him. That his will guided Bagramon to Earth.

Unknown Neo
09-21-2011, 04:29 PM
Hey, it's ep 52. So we have two eps left for this season?

So we're at the final fight so with the best army of Bagramon left being sent out, we get the Great Xros.

The army was a bunch of Black Chess Evos. Rook and Knight I think.

Compared to DarkKnightmon, Bagramon is much, much, smaller.

Speaking of the big evil, He goes to get Yuu who's not playing games anymore.

Of course, if he could have brought Damemon back, maybe Yuu'd want to help more.

Since Yuu won't fight, he'll just have to be fuel for a Xros. Yuu doesn't want to, and leaves.

Except that the mouse stopped him. Stupid ChuuChuumon.

Xros Flare is taking out so many, I can hardly tell who they are.

Bagramon wants to kill everyone who's against him before doing D5. But DarkKnightmon wants to have them see how they failed, then kill them. It's more fun that way of course. heh

Hey. A Black BishopChessmon.

I thought both lines had a Black and White version. It makes sense because of them being chess pieces.

And finally, Bagramon gets off his arse and meets everyone. Since he absorbed the Dark Stone.

So I guess no one else knew the Brother thing between the villains.

X7 rushes in to fight but Bagramon just knocks everything aside and grabs him.

He only knocked them out of X7 not out of Super Evo too.

So D5 is an acronym. Dimension Delete and Deadly Destruction Day

It's wordy but it fits.

So much like last season, instead of hitting the Digiworld's Reset, Bagramon wants to hit everyone's Reset button and make everything his.

Of course, by destroying I mean beating all the villains, that charged the Dark Stone up.

Taiki now figures out that the hand that knocked him out into the Human World, was Bagramon's.

That Bone Right Hand reaches into the human world to Japan. (instead of a red right hand which is a trope)

And now he uses his White Left Hand to knock Mervamon, Knightmon, and Cyberdramon back and Taiki down into a chasm.

This ep has SoundBirdmon. A flying black and red Bat-winged Eyeball.

Hey. It's Japan. Koto, Tokyo.

Hey! It's Akari and Zenjirou. Haven't seen them in a while.

Remember Tactimon and his sword?

Of course Akari misses Taiki.

Zen misses him too probably but for different reasons.

That sword is pretty broken down at the bottom of the water there.

Zen tried to do a Spirit Bomb to get back the the Digiworld but Akari tells him that pose is stupid.

Everyone Panic! It's a black portal with a bone hand coming out of it.

They also notice how it looks failure.

And it freezes everything. Including Taiki's mom.

Now the sword is gone.

The hand is also stone now. But not Akari and Zen. They're getting yelled to follow a voice.

It seems he grabbed the Rainbow Bridge. Which is a real place and misspelled in the link from Wikimon's D5 entry.

Taiki is stuck somewhere with Mervamon and Knightmon. How do they get out?

So... Kiriha got his Loader from Bagramon. How bout that.

In order to beat DarkKnightmon, Bagramon did the same. Yuu or Kiriha. Which would be better.

And since Kiriha is the bleep bleep Batmon, he was picked for a Xros Loader. He wanted power.

Omegamon is how Taiki got here. And Bagramon says Kiriha is a failure.

And since Kiriha went through character development, He knows that Friendship is Power! And since he's Kiriha, Shoutmon will him and MetalGreymon under his command.

Bagramon blocks everything with his normal hand and since he hasn't done anything since ever, he'll block all the attacks himself. DarkKnightmon can stand back.

Taiiki and group find a Human Xros power storage area. What could they do? I'd destroy it myself.

Surprisingly Bagramon, being half tree from a horrible thing in his bio, is getting hurt by blocking everything with his one hand.

But with his power of Hax... I mean the DarkStone, he casts Heal and fixes his arm.

A big clash of attacks knocks him back some and knocks them out of Super Evo.

Now back with Taiki. Maybe he can find Yuu while the Chessmon are busy.

With the dust clearing, Bagramon was jabbed in his chest by DarkKnightmon's spear.

DarkKnightmon, being super evil genius that he is, used Xros Flare to distract Bagramon so his hands were busy and he could beat him.

And with his theme playing, DarkKnightmon Xroses himself with Bagramon to a more DarkKnight version of DarknessBagramon.

Nene has a box of something, the Monitamon are in a bear suit. And a wolf suit. And they remind us of how Splashmon made a city in a Whamon as his melody is a pretty heavy sound.

Yes, next ep will be very good. Very good indeed.

Bartz
09-21-2011, 07:06 PM
So Bagramon was the one who brought Kiriha to the Digital World.

That... brings up more questions then it answers. If he brought him into the world, why didn't he, oh I don't know, recruit him the minute he set foot there?! There are more benefits having him on his side then letting him parade around constantly wrecking his Officers plans. He was easily on the level of Taiki's group since they first met and would've proved a challenge (or at least, a distraction) for Taiki while he continued with his plans. Hell, even if Bagramon couldn't do it, why not send Tactimon or Lilithmon to get him? Both could be very persuasive to the power-hungry Kiriha (what with Tactimon's value for power and Lilithmon's manipulations) and I'm sure either of them could've got him on their side easily. So really there is no reason for him to not recruit Kiriha onto his side as soon as possible.

Another minor gripe stemming from that is that it undercuts Greymon and (by extension) Mailbirdramon's characterization since we don't know why he met nor why they're so loyal to him. Both are already pretty underdeveloped in comparison to the three main Xros Heart members, Sparrowmon and Mervamon, so why can't we see why they become loyal to him when we saw why the other aforementioned members become so attached to their partners?

Tyranno
09-21-2011, 08:04 PM
I think Bagramon was trying for a sink or swim mentality. Have Kiriha prove himself by clawing his way up from the bottom.

Heck, he pretty much all but says this, talking about how Kiriha's actions ended up disappointing him. Bagramon was a lot more hands off in how he approached things than Kiriha was.

TMS
09-21-2011, 08:44 PM
That's one thing I actually liked about this episode. We now have a good reason for Bagramon never leaving his throne. As he explains here, he didn't have to do shit! Both his minions and enemies were busy collecting the Code Crowns for him, all of which he took so easily when the time came. He did the same thing with gathering negative energy. He already knew that his brother was a backstabbing asshole, and had no worries on that count. I wouldn't be surprised if next episode we learn that he fully expected DarkKnightmon to force DigiXros him. Bagramon has the power to manipulate souls (even if we've never seen him use it in the anime); DarkKnightmon should have known better.

Bartz
09-21-2011, 08:46 PM
I think Bagramon was trying for a sink or swim mentality. Have Kiriha prove himself by clawing his way up from the bottom.

Heck, he pretty much all but says this, talking about how Kiriha's actions ended up disappointing him. Bagramon was a lot more hands off in how he approached things than Kiriha was.


There are still a few holes in that logic. Firstly, digixrosing is treated as a powerful, but mysterious force that can change the tide of battle, which could've proven to be a threat to him later on. Hell, it was already shown to give the Three Officers more than enough trouble, so what's to say Kiriha couldn't one day find a way to surpass him? Also, repeating what I said earlier, having that on his side would've easily sped up his plans, as well as gave him an ally that could fight Taiki and Nene on the same level that even Tactimon couldn't even match.

Another problem with that is that means he allowed Kiriha to be a thorn in his side for months. His officers could've been more efficient without the interference, which means his plans would've been completed faster, and the protagonists would be at more of a disadvantage. In fact, adding to the last point, there are multiple points where Kiriha's interference prevented Taiki from losing, which means that without Kiriha, Bagramon's army would've had more chances to succeed. So essentially, Bagramon was shooting himself in the foot to build up a potential ally that may not have paid off anyway.

Finally, what if Kiriha gained enough power, but rejected him? Kiriha has been noted to share some similarities to Neo Saiba from V-Tamers, and like him, probably would've looked for ways to backstab Bagramon once he had the chance. Granted, DarkKnightmon had the same idea and failed, but that still doesn't excuse the fact that Kiriha could've been a wild card for him. At least, if Kiriha's under his watch, that allows him to keep more of a watchful eye on his actions.

Lhikan634
09-21-2011, 09:17 PM
Interesting episode. It actually seems to link both arcs fairly well, resuming earth-time (which was maybe seconds or less in the Digital-World time). Tactimon's sword… Akari and Zen… more chaos in the human world!!! And then suddenly everything, including Baguramon's arm, turn to stone… making his arm look just like a petrified tree root system to me…

Is it just me, or does it seem like something's more or less freezing time in the human world for Zen and Akari to act? (haven't seen the next ep, please don't spoil details, lol…). I have my suspicions of the reason.

D5… interesting, I caught the destroy dimensions bit down… also that it might be an acronym dealing with destruction day… I have to applaud Baguramon for aiming high, in the least.

Darkness… Knightmon? DarkestKnightmon? what to call that form until they name him (if they name him…). I see more than just the head difference myself. Hopefully they make them out to be two unique digimon (just like Arkadimon and Dæmon SM). (and I so called that twist… woo-hoo!). Odd, Baguramon seems just a tad calmer than you'd expect for being absorbed… wonder if he has his own plans… (nah…)

Tyranno
09-21-2011, 10:22 PM
There are still a few holes in that logic. Firstly, digixrosing is treated as a powerful, but mysterious force that can change the tide of battle, which could've proven to be a threat to him later on. Hell, it was already shown to give the Three Officers more than enough trouble, so what's to say Kiriha couldn't one day find a way to surpass him? Also, repeating what I said earlier, having that on his side would've easily sped up his plans, as well as gave him an ally that could fight Taiki and Nene on the same level that even Tactimon couldn't even match.

Another problem with that is that means he allowed Kiriha to be a thorn in his side for months. His officers could've been more efficient without the interference, which means his plans would've been completed faster, and the protagonists would be at more of a disadvantage. In fact, adding to the last point, there are multiple points where Kiriha's interference prevented Taiki from losing, which means that without Kiriha, Bagramon's army would've had more chances to succeed. So essentially, Bagramon was shooting himself in the foot to build up a potential ally that may not have paid off anyway.

Finally, what if Kiriha gained enough power, but rejected him? Kiriha has been noted to share some similarities to Neo Saiba from V-Tamers, and like him, probably would've looked for ways to backstab Bagramon once he had the chance. Granted, DarkKnightmon had the same idea and failed, but that still doesn't excuse the fact that Kiriha could've been a wild card for him. At least, if Kiriha's under his watch, that allows him to keep more of a watchful eye on his actions.


Well, Baguramon's shown he's willing to give his brother a place, though he knew DarkKnightmon was openly antagonistic towards him.

Baguramon seems to believe in a twisted kind of meritocracy where you have to earn your place at his side, which DarkKnightmon did by handicapping Blastmon and gaining the Darkness Loader. It makes sense that he'd extend this philosophy to Kiriha, even if it wasn't easier for him in the long run.


Darkness… Knightmon? DarkestKnightmon? what to call that form until they name him (if they name him…). I see more than just the head difference myself. Hopefully they make them out to be two unique digimon (just like Arkadimon and Dæmon SM). (and I so called that twist… woo-hoo!). Odd, Baguramon seems just a tad calmer than you'd expect for being absorbed… wonder if he has his own plans… (nah…)

Since the final form is DarknessBagramon, I call this one BagraKnightmon, myself.

Sabrblade
09-22-2011, 04:45 AM
Darkness… Knightmon? DarkestKnightmon? what to call that form until they name him (if they name him…)."BagraKnightmon"? ;)

Exiled
09-22-2011, 04:54 AM
Or DarkKnightmon+Bagramon, like DKmon digixroses in the manga.

Inpu
09-22-2011, 06:40 AM
Baguramon seems to believe in a twisted kind of meritocracy where you have to earn your place at his side, which DarkKnightmon did by handicapping Blastmon and gaining the Darkness Loader. It makes sense that he'd extend this philosophy to Kiriha, even if it wasn't easier for him in the long run.

Kinda hilarious, then, that when he loses next episode it will be almost solely due to him holding onto that Idiot Ball for all it's worth.

Also hilarious that Greymon and MailBirdramon don't make sense any more, especially since they would have made more sense as Bagra members anyway.

Bartz
09-22-2011, 08:02 AM
Well, Baguramon's shown he's willing to give his brother a place, though he knew DarkKnightmon was openly antagonistic towards him.

Baguramon seems to believe in a twisted kind of meritocracy where you have to earn your place at his side, which DarkKnightmon did by handicapping Blastmon and gaining the Darkness Loader. It makes sense that he'd extend this philosophy to Kiriha, even if it wasn't easier for him in the long run.


While that does make sense character-wise, that still means Bagramon allowed a potential ally to completely wreck his plans, help out the opposing team and eventually betray him. So logically, this falls through because even if he was trying to toughen up Kiriha, he allowed him to get stronger just to ally with the other team! So not only did he completely ruin his plans for Kiriha, but he also allowed the protagonists a chance to stop his "perfect world" from becoming reality as well.

CloneWarrior
09-22-2011, 08:18 AM
Darkness… Knightmon? DarkestKnightmon? what to call that form until they name him (if they name him…). I see more than just the head difference myself. Hopefully they make them out to be two unique digimon (just like Arkadimon and Dæmon SM). (and I so called that twist… woo-hoo!). Odd, Baguramon seems just a tad calmer than you'd expect for being absorbed… wonder if he has his own plans… (nah…)


The only attack the Xros uses is "God of Death Snatcher" which is one of DarknessBagramon's attacks. I think it's safe to say they're just considered different versions of DarknessBagramon.

WereGarurumon
09-22-2011, 09:28 AM
While that does make sense character-wise, that still means Bagramon allowed a potential ally to completely wreck his plans, help out the opposing team and eventually betray him. So logically, this falls through because even if he was trying to toughen up Kiriha, he allowed him to get stronger just to ally with the other team! So not only did he completely ruin his plans for Kiriha, but he also allowed the protagonists a chance to stop his "perfect world" from becoming reality as well.


He probably didn't anticipate him loving the friendship.

Unknown Neo
09-22-2011, 04:58 PM
Darkness… Knightmon? DarkestKnightmon? what to call that form until they name him (if they name him…).

Both those work.



Well, Baguramon's shown he's willing to give his brother a place, though he knew DarkKnightmon was openly antagonistic towards him.

Since the final form is DarknessBagramon, I call this one BagraKnightmon, myself.

I thought that's how they acted. Trying to out do each other. Also, BagraKnightmon works too.

Tyranno
09-22-2011, 10:03 PM
While that does make sense character-wise, that still means Bagramon allowed a potential ally to completely wreck his plans, help out the opposing team and eventually betray him. So logically, this falls through because even if he was trying to toughen up Kiriha, he allowed him to get stronger just to ally with the other team! So not only did he completely ruin his plans for Kiriha, but he also allowed the protagonists a chance to stop his "perfect world" from becoming reality as well.


I never said Bagramon was the smartest guy. I'm just saying, the guy's a man of extreme ego, who sits in his position of power with maximum comfort, and expects people to earn their position at his side rather than him helping them.

It's gonna bite him in the ass, yes, but many villains are defined by a fatal flaw. For DarkKnightmon, it's his complete inability to trust anyone. For Bagramon, it's his own skewed execution of how much might makes right.

Inpu
09-23-2011, 06:51 AM
Well, if the DigiXros didn't have the same attacks as DarknessBagramon, and the regular DBmon didn't say "I'm the TRUE DBmon", I would go with "MidnightBagramon". 'cause of the pun. BagraKnightmon seems pretty weak, to me.

Sabrblade
09-23-2011, 09:06 AM
Well, if the DigiXros didn't have the same attacks as DarknessBagramon, and the regular DBmon didn't say "I'm the TRUE DBmon", I would go with "MidnightBagramon". 'cause of the pun. BagraKnightmon seems pretty weak, to me.
How 'bout "DarkKnightBagramon"?

Inpu
09-23-2011, 09:45 AM
How 'bout "DarkKnightBagramon"?

aaaarrrrrgghhh...that's so unoriginal, though.

Bartz
09-23-2011, 10:05 AM
I never said Bagramon was the smartest guy. I'm just saying, the guy's a man of extreme ego, who sits in his position of power with maximum comfort, and expects people to earn their position at his side rather than him helping them.

It's gonna bite him in the ass, yes, but many villains are defined by a fatal flaw. For DarkKnightmon, it's his complete inability to trust anyone. For Bagramon, it's his own skewed execution of how much might makes right.


I see your point, it's just that I'm quite irritated at how passive he's been throughout this series, you know? It's like that fatal flaw of his just completely overtakes his character.

Sabrblade
09-23-2011, 10:18 AM
aaaarrrrrgghhh...that's so unoriginal, though.
LOL :D :D :D I could think of worse, though. ;)

Exodd
09-26-2011, 07:17 PM
Do Zenjirou and Ballistamon share a voice actor? Sounded like Ballistamon during one of the lines for Zenjirou.
For being introduced as a force directly under Bagramon, the Chessmon didn't do much. They barely even got to appear on screen before being wiped out.
This episode didn't seem as exciting as I expected, but that's probably because of spoilers. At least Bagramon's attacks looked cool.

Inpu
09-26-2011, 10:46 PM
Do Zenjirou and Ballistamon share a voice actor? Sounded like Ballistamon during one of the lines for Zenjirou.
For being introduced as a force directly under Bagramon, the Chessmon didn't do much. They barely even got to appear on screen before being wiped out.
This episode didn't seem as exciting as I expected, but that's probably because of spoilers. At least Bagramon's attacks looked cool.

No, but Kiriha, Bagramon, and Ballistamon do.